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foreign

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thank you

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foreign

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[Music]

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if we were facing an alien threat from

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outside which worked

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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[Music]

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this is Fade to Black with your host

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Jimmy Church on the game changer Radio

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I need your help to get to the year

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you're listening to fade to black with

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Jimmy judge on The Game Changer Network

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[Music]

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bespoke radio

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4. the

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[Music]

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masses

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uh yeah man how you doing how you doing

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today is Wednesday September 28th

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2022. let's do this

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I would like to welcome everybody

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listening all around the world all

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across the United States

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hither and tither to and fro back and

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forth up and down east and west north

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and south far and near

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this is Fade to Black for kjcr the game

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changer and NX networks race Hobbs

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I'm Yours Jimmy Church what is cracking

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everybody how you doing how you doing

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how you doing yeah man what a great week

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um Blockbuster week

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Blockbuster week just just an incredible

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incredible week you know started the

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bottom shells off uh Monday night with a

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grant Cameron

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then we had bombshell Night 2 last night

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when I broke down the Wilson Davis

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document we went page for page and went

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through the highlights and tonight

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bombshell night number three Richard

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Dolan is here

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that's right Wilson Davis Knight three

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man what is going on I love it I love it

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I will always support the UFO Community

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ufology uh this is what it's all about

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right here the community coming together

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and getting the work done

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and tonight the best Richard Dolan is

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here tomorrow night is another fader

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night with open lines all night long and

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I can't wait to get to tomorrow night

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what a what a week

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so much fun all right so much fun coming

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up I will be hosting and I'm seeing the

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conscious life Expo this February 10th

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through the 13th at The Lax Hilton

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tickets and info right there the links

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are below you can head over to

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consciouslifeexpo.com and then coming up

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right after that April 7th through the

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14th 2023 I will be hosting and

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presenting on the hidden secrets seminar

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at Sea cruise again the links are below

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Scott Walter Adam Apollo Nick Pope Brad

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Olson Vivian Chauvet and and a bunch of

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other amazing presenters and I'm going

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to get more into that uh next month and

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start breaking that down and bring some

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people on the show to talk about it okay

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so

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um that's coming up April 7th through

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the 14th

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um we are almost in October

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and of course that means Halloween

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and Shaw The Loon witch will be joining

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us again I think this will be

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our eighth year uh I've got to go back

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and check on that I think that's the or

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could this be your number nine

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with a Shaw The Loon witch and then

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um right after that on Halloween itself

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uh will be the the ex the k-u-n-x uh

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their first anniversary special event

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will be going down we'll be broadcasting

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it from here

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um I think if I have a crystal ball you

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know I might be the co-host uh with uh

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race Hobbs on that and uh Margie K and

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uh coming in and and doing that so a lot

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of uh special things are going to go

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down

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um uh that evening so you don't want to

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miss that of course we'll be making

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those announcements too as well but I

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love Halloween

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um you know for me yeah you know

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Independence Day and Memorial Day okay

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all right I got three holidays uh you

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know that I look forward to Halloween

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that it is a holiday

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Thanksgiving and Christmas

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those are the big three uh for me and

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man man I just love Halloween so and uh

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so that's going down on on Halloween

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night and uh before then you can get

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your free membership to the NX Network

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just head over to the nxnetwork.com and

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I get the free monthly newsletter and

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the blog access and event notices and

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you get a free digital copy of their

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quarterly magazine too as well it's all

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simple to do uh the unexnetwork.com head

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over there it's right there on the home

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page memberships you just click and and

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get it done it's all free go and do it

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right now EdenPURE uh probably uh we'll

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be doing this through the end of the

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month which is their thunderstorm three

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pack special on uh I mean it's just the

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I can't believe how much this has

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changed

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um I am

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I am a bit of a a neat freak I'm not a

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germophobe I'm not like that I don't go

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around and you know wipe surfaces and

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freak out and don't hand shake or do

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those things no I'm not like that I

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don't have kleenex ever you know no but

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I am a neat freak and I just love and

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organized home I like everything in its

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place and not like the floors clean and

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I just you know I just like that because

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I have guests over and when I have a

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guest come in and this right here has

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just relieved my anxiety with that

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the thunderstorms are the absolute very

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best and I just keep them running all

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the time you can't hear them they're

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nearly invisible you can plug it in the

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walls got a USB you can plug it in the

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car and you just know that you're not

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going to have anxiety when you have

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guests or family over you don't want

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your mom coming over and and coming in

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and sniffing the house because that's

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what they do well you can relax about

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that kills viruses

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um uh germs and it just smells great

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just like it smells right after a

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thunderstorm so get yours now it's AC

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it's USB three pack special save two

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hundred dollars on three and free

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shipping promo code is fader three the

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links are below you can follow me on

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Twitter at Jay churchradio that's right

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you can follow rich rich Dolan it's got

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he's got this new Twitter handle

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um man I've talked to him about this for

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years uh his his Twitter name and uh so

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what is it now

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what what's just follow Richard I've got

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it uh uh our social media people have

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put his his new Twitter handle up so ID

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Rich Dolan what what is it man I'm gonna

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Rich

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Nolan okay intelligent ID official

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I underscore D underscore official do

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you got that all right we've got it up

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in social media and uh so go and do that

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let's see seventy four thousand

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followers

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wow

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holy crap I when I bring Richard out of

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the show I remember this is really funny

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this is years ago

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uh I said

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Richard are you on Twitter I think so I

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think I set up a Twitter account I said

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yeah I am too how's that going for you I

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don't know yeah I don't really check it

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either I don't really follow it

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and look at him now

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74

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000 followers go follow Rich Dolan right

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there on Twitter let's get to the

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breaking news

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it's going down on the east coast today

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of course we all know that hurricane Ian

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made landfall this afternoon along the

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southwestern Coast of Florida near Cayo

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Costa as a powerful category uh category

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category four storm hurricane Ian is now

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tied with Hurricane Charlie uh back in

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2004 as the strongest storm to make

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landfall on the west coast of Florida

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both of those storms hit the coast with

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150 mile per hour winds Ian dropped

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slightly from 155 to 150 miles per hour

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at landfall right now more than one

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million customers are without power

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hurricane Ian could remain at Hurricane

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strength for the next 24 hours as it

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cuts across Florida

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and you know things are getting really

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serious when Waffle House closes

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um and that is the Jerry boss the vice

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president of public relations at Waffle

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House announced that 21 Waffle House

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locations were closed across Florida

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today because they were in the direct

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path of the storm and Craig fugatti who

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once ran Florida's division of Emergency

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Management coined the term The Waffle

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House Index to determine the severity of

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Storms and this is due to the fact that

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Waffle House rarely closes yeah our

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thoughts are with everybody in Florida

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it's absolutely incredible uh everybody

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stay safe all right okay

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just in time for Halloween talking about

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Halloween earlier Baskin Robbins October

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flavor is spicy and spooky with swirls

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of dark chocolate ice cream with white

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chocolate ghost pepper ice cream

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featuring the flavor of one of the

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world's hottest chilies ranking uh are

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you ready 1 million forty one thousand

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four twenty seven on the Scoville heat

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unit scale the scoop also includes

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flakes of blood orange for a sweet spicy

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fruity scoop that's not for the faint of

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heart and I am going to go and check

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that out Italy's Samantha

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Christo Ferretti today became the first

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European woman to take over the command

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of the International Space Station

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during a ceremony broadcast Live from

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Space earlier today the outgoing

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Commander Russian cosmonaut olid

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artemayev used the occasion to seemingly

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make a rare space-bound reference to the

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war in Ukraine saying that and I quote

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despite the storms on Earth our

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International cooperation continues end

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quote during the relaxed ceremony art

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MAV handed a Christo Ferretti a golden

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key symbolizing that she is the new

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commander of the space station until she

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returns to Earth on get this

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October 10th my birthday yeah it's

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pretty cool let's get this show cracking

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on this day in history

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48 BC

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upon Landing in Egypt Roman general and

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politician Pompeii is murdered on the

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orders of King Ptolemy of Egypt now see

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what was going on back then you know

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Richard Dolan he's the historian he

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knows about all this stuff he thinks

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about this stuff every day but I know a

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little bit and so Ptolemy uh was he was

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buddies with Caesar

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and and Ptolemy thought that well you

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know uh I'm with Rome I've got this deal

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with Ptolemy and now I want to do

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something else so I'm going to go to

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Egypt and I'm going to see if I can get

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some kind of a lions going all right

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well now Ptolemy was

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really close with Caesar

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and that wasn't gonna happen so this is

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what Tommy did he said

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00:17:39,710 --> 00:17:37,740
I wasn't there but you know this is this

277
00:17:42,289 --> 00:17:39,720
is more or less what happened so the

278
00:17:44,090 --> 00:17:42,299
Roman ships you know they're docked and

279
00:17:46,610 --> 00:17:44,100
uh he says hey

280
00:17:49,190 --> 00:17:46,620
come on over for dinner

281
00:17:51,770 --> 00:17:49,200
so they launched the boat and he the

282
00:17:53,750 --> 00:17:51,780
second he set foot on the beach

283
00:17:58,850 --> 00:17:53,760
you gotta take it out

284
00:18:01,250 --> 00:17:58,860
just like that on this day in 48 BC all

285
00:18:04,190 --> 00:18:01,260
right here's your fader fact

286
00:18:07,930 --> 00:18:04,200
the first this is a fader fact this is

287
00:18:11,930 --> 00:18:07,940
kind of mind-blowing actually the first

288
00:18:13,669 --> 00:18:11,940
hand-held mobile phone call

289
00:18:15,789 --> 00:18:13,679
was made

290
00:18:20,289 --> 00:18:15,799
April 3rd

291
00:18:23,690 --> 00:18:20,299
1973 in New York City

292
00:18:25,850 --> 00:18:23,700
1973. that's crazy isn't it there you go

293
00:18:28,250 --> 00:18:25,860
that's your fader fact tonight we

294
00:18:31,370 --> 00:18:28,260
welcome very special guest Richard Dolan

295
00:18:33,890 --> 00:18:31,380
is here Wilson Davis

296
00:18:36,289 --> 00:18:33,900
night three bombshell night three

297
00:18:37,610 --> 00:18:36,299
tonight Richard is here and uh tomorrow

298
00:18:40,130 --> 00:18:37,620
night's another fader night with open

299
00:18:41,330 --> 00:18:40,140
lines all night long all right let me

300
00:18:49,190 --> 00:18:41,340
hit this

301
00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:53,029
oh man

302
00:18:53,039 --> 00:18:57,430
half and half

303
00:19:01,850 --> 00:18:59,810
and half tonight

304
00:19:02,590 --> 00:19:01,860
man nothing like half and half and

305
00:19:09,230 --> 00:19:02,600
coffee

306
00:19:13,190 --> 00:19:09,240
I do

307
00:19:14,930 --> 00:19:13,200
is going to be with us at the bottom of

308
00:19:19,490 --> 00:19:14,940
the hour

309
00:19:20,810 --> 00:19:19,500
um and uh I wanted to

310
00:19:23,390 --> 00:19:20,820
um I wanted to talk about a couple of

311
00:19:26,870 --> 00:19:23,400
things number one I want to talk about

312
00:19:30,049 --> 00:19:26,880
TV and aliens

313
00:19:32,270 --> 00:19:30,059
um but uh there's a lot of good

314
00:19:35,150 --> 00:19:32,280
programming on right now but over the

315
00:19:37,250 --> 00:19:35,160
last couple of weeks and I kind of threw

316
00:19:39,549 --> 00:19:37,260
this out there at everybody that this is

317
00:19:41,090 --> 00:19:39,559
what was going to be going on

318
00:19:43,970 --> 00:19:41,100
I

319
00:19:46,190 --> 00:19:43,980
binged

320
00:19:49,970 --> 00:19:46,200
eight seasons

321
00:19:52,490 --> 00:19:49,980
of Brooklyn Nine-Nine all right

322
00:19:56,270 --> 00:19:52,500
okay now

323
00:19:59,570 --> 00:19:56,280
um uh Adam Sandberg there's a reason for

324
00:20:03,289 --> 00:19:59,580
this it there's an alien connection here

325
00:20:06,890 --> 00:20:03,299
Adam Sandberg I became a fan of uh after

326
00:20:10,970 --> 00:20:06,900
I watched and own and

327
00:20:13,490 --> 00:20:10,980
viewed 50 times uh the movie Hot Rod

328
00:20:16,250 --> 00:20:13,500
and Adam Sandberg is so good in that so

329
00:20:18,230 --> 00:20:16,260
anyway I've just become an Adam Sandberg

330
00:20:21,110 --> 00:20:18,240
fan now we're talking about eight

331
00:20:24,350 --> 00:20:21,120
seasons and you know this goes back to I

332
00:20:26,570 --> 00:20:24,360
think 2000 and uh well eight seasons it

333
00:20:29,029 --> 00:20:26,580
ended in 2021 so it must have started in

334
00:20:31,669 --> 00:20:29,039
like 2012 2013 but I missed Brooklyn

335
00:20:34,490 --> 00:20:31,679
Nine-Nine uh when it first came out I

336
00:20:37,370 --> 00:20:34,500
watched like the first episode of the

337
00:20:41,270 --> 00:20:37,380
first season back then and I I just

338
00:20:42,950 --> 00:20:41,280
never watched it and and I went back a

339
00:20:44,650 --> 00:20:42,960
couple of weeks ago started to get into

340
00:20:49,430 --> 00:20:44,660
it and couldn't stop

341
00:20:53,630 --> 00:20:49,440
so to binge eight seasons of a TV show

342
00:20:57,590 --> 00:20:53,640
that is 20 episodes per season

343
00:21:00,169 --> 00:20:57,600
um on my Limited schedule I'm very busy

344
00:21:03,289 --> 00:21:00,179
um has occupied all of my TV time that's

345
00:21:05,690 --> 00:21:03,299
it that's it the only thing I squeezed

346
00:21:07,490 --> 00:21:05,700
in in the middle of that Madness was uh

347
00:21:10,130 --> 00:21:07,500
Thor love and thunder other than that

348
00:21:11,529 --> 00:21:10,140
it's been Brooklyn nine nine here at

349
00:21:14,630 --> 00:21:11,539
Cassidy church

350
00:21:18,049 --> 00:21:14,640
that being said now Brooklyn Nine-Nine

351
00:21:20,390 --> 00:21:18,059
is great and I realize it's not aliens

352
00:21:23,090 --> 00:21:20,400
right I did watch the last episode of

353
00:21:27,169 --> 00:21:23,100
Resident alien by the way uh

354
00:21:29,630 --> 00:21:27,179
good job Giorgio sukulos spoiler alert

355
00:21:32,090 --> 00:21:29,640
um but back to Brooklyn Nine-Nine it's

356
00:21:34,970 --> 00:21:32,100
not aliens no

357
00:21:37,850 --> 00:21:34,980
it's not it's funny

358
00:21:39,649 --> 00:21:37,860
um and then when you get into uh that

359
00:21:42,470 --> 00:21:39,659
many seasons and you get into the

360
00:21:44,289 --> 00:21:42,480
characters and and what is going on it

361
00:21:47,630 --> 00:21:44,299
becomes very addictive and very

362
00:21:50,570 --> 00:21:47,640
compelling so that's it it took up my

363
00:21:55,549 --> 00:21:50,580
time but here's the deal

364
00:21:57,890 --> 00:21:55,559
I've been cheating on Brooklyn Nine-Nine

365
00:22:00,190 --> 00:21:57,900
I have been watching

366
00:22:04,250 --> 00:22:00,200
War of the Worlds

367
00:22:06,230 --> 00:22:04,260
and here's my take of of what uh what is

368
00:22:10,789 --> 00:22:06,240
ultimately Happening Here

369
00:22:12,470 --> 00:22:10,799
the new version of War of the Worlds

370
00:22:15,649 --> 00:22:12,480
which is on epics and I think you can

371
00:22:19,070 --> 00:22:15,659
also see it on on Apple TV

372
00:22:22,610 --> 00:22:19,080
um because of that I went back and I

373
00:22:25,850 --> 00:22:22,620
watched the original 1955 film

374
00:22:28,789 --> 00:22:25,860
um I went back this is all over the last

375
00:22:32,110 --> 00:22:28,799
three weeks I watched the Steven

376
00:22:35,990 --> 00:22:32,120
Spielberg remake with Tom Cruise

377
00:22:37,909 --> 00:22:36,000
and and went back and watched parts of

378
00:22:39,590 --> 00:22:37,919
the first season of war the worlds

379
00:22:42,590 --> 00:22:39,600
there's three seasons out

380
00:22:45,430 --> 00:22:42,600
and here's the here's the thing this is

381
00:22:47,570 --> 00:22:45,440
this is my take and I've always

382
00:22:51,110 --> 00:22:47,580
I've always thought about the way that

383
00:22:54,590 --> 00:22:51,120
the media presents Alien Invasion stuff

384
00:22:57,409 --> 00:22:54,600
and and especially like if you watch the

385
00:23:00,470 --> 00:22:57,419
original uh War of the Worlds or or

386
00:23:02,930 --> 00:23:00,480
listen to the radio presentation or uh

387
00:23:08,470 --> 00:23:02,940
the Tom Cruise Steven Spielberg version

388
00:23:11,750 --> 00:23:08,480
or Independence Day or or or right okay

389
00:23:13,490 --> 00:23:11,760
there's something I always think that

390
00:23:15,350 --> 00:23:13,500
there's a message there you know look at

391
00:23:17,630 --> 00:23:15,360
the movie arrival right there's always

392
00:23:20,330 --> 00:23:17,640
something going on with the way that the

393
00:23:23,270 --> 00:23:20,340
media is handling this and then you go

394
00:23:27,950 --> 00:23:23,280
and watch this new version of War of the

395
00:23:35,570 --> 00:23:30,890
it's too real

396
00:23:39,409 --> 00:23:35,580
there is

397
00:23:41,690 --> 00:23:39,419
something going on with with the way

398
00:23:43,610 --> 00:23:41,700
that this is presented now here's the

399
00:23:45,529 --> 00:23:43,620
other take and I'm going to get to the

400
00:23:49,090 --> 00:23:45,539
reason why I'm bringing this up

401
00:23:53,770 --> 00:23:49,100
is that this is

402
00:23:55,970 --> 00:23:53,780
a European version of it now remember

403
00:23:58,310 --> 00:23:55,980
the original version of war the world

404
00:24:01,669 --> 00:23:58,320
took place in New Jersey

405
00:24:04,549 --> 00:24:01,679
um and the uh the radio broadcast New

406
00:24:07,010 --> 00:24:04,559
Jersey right East Coast American take on

407
00:24:10,909 --> 00:24:07,020
it Steven Spielberg New York City

408
00:24:12,590 --> 00:24:10,919
Northeast right that take that spin it

409
00:24:15,350 --> 00:24:12,600
was a little bit of New York City of

410
00:24:18,470 --> 00:24:15,360
course and then uh ended up in Boston uh

411
00:24:20,330 --> 00:24:18,480
later but again uh Northeast but an

412
00:24:23,529 --> 00:24:20,340
American take

413
00:24:26,450 --> 00:24:23,539
an American Film company the new version

414
00:24:31,310 --> 00:24:26,460
of War of the World which is three

415
00:24:36,110 --> 00:24:31,320
seasons long now has nothing to do with

416
00:24:39,350 --> 00:24:36,120
the original H.G Wells or uh the

417
00:24:42,409 --> 00:24:39,360
original broadcast uh radio and so forth

418
00:24:44,330 --> 00:24:42,419
the way that they do this production and

419
00:24:45,710 --> 00:24:44,340
if you haven't seen it and this is the

420
00:24:48,710 --> 00:24:45,720
other thing it's been under the radar

421
00:24:51,770 --> 00:24:48,720
it's been like buried on epics there's

422
00:24:55,490 --> 00:24:51,780
not a whole lot of promotion behind it

423
00:24:58,250 --> 00:24:55,500
um it's buried on Apple TV uh I I don't

424
00:25:01,490 --> 00:24:58,260
know why they're not promoting it uh uh

425
00:25:04,549 --> 00:25:01,500
more and and doing more marketing but

426
00:25:06,409 --> 00:25:04,559
because of this European flavor

427
00:25:08,870 --> 00:25:06,419
um that is here because it takes place

428
00:25:11,750 --> 00:25:08,880
in Europe takes place in London it takes

429
00:25:13,090 --> 00:25:11,760
place in the Alps it takes place uh

430
00:25:17,870 --> 00:25:13,100
throughout Europe

431
00:25:23,090 --> 00:25:17,880
and it's the the European version

432
00:25:26,029 --> 00:25:23,100
of what it would be if if ET invaded

433
00:25:28,610 --> 00:25:26,039
now here's here's the thing this is

434
00:25:31,010 --> 00:25:28,620
where it gets crazy

435
00:25:34,149 --> 00:25:31,020
you don't have the giant robots that are

436
00:25:38,390 --> 00:25:34,159
20 stories tall with three legs no

437
00:25:41,470 --> 00:25:38,400
the aliens in this you have to go watch

438
00:25:45,529 --> 00:25:41,480
it and you'll understand are robot dogs

439
00:25:49,250 --> 00:25:45,539
and the robot dogs are very similar to

440
00:25:51,409 --> 00:25:49,260
the Boston Dynamics uh robot dogs so you

441
00:25:54,350 --> 00:25:51,419
have that that's the enemy

442
00:25:58,730 --> 00:25:54,360
vicious little robot dogs

443
00:26:02,169 --> 00:25:58,740
they don't have ray guns right they

444
00:26:05,990 --> 00:26:02,179
don't have lasers they shoot bullets

445
00:26:08,029 --> 00:26:06,000
very accurately one at a time not

446
00:26:09,950 --> 00:26:08,039
machine it just it's like this

447
00:26:12,110 --> 00:26:09,960
terrifying

448
00:26:14,269 --> 00:26:12,120
situation where you're dealing with a

449
00:26:17,529 --> 00:26:14,279
little robot dog

450
00:26:20,690 --> 00:26:17,539
that is going to take a one kill shot

451
00:26:22,669 --> 00:26:20,700
that's pretty trippy there's that part

452
00:26:25,250 --> 00:26:22,679
second though

453
00:26:27,830 --> 00:26:25,260
is they communicate

454
00:26:30,710 --> 00:26:27,840
with frequencies

455
00:26:32,690 --> 00:26:30,720
so now with all of this talk that is

456
00:26:35,269 --> 00:26:32,700
going on today and this is why you need

457
00:26:37,130 --> 00:26:35,279
to go and and see the series is there a

458
00:26:40,870 --> 00:26:37,140
message going on here

459
00:26:45,250 --> 00:26:40,880
because there is so much talk about

460
00:26:49,850 --> 00:26:45,260
frequencies uh with with uaps and UFOs

461
00:26:52,549 --> 00:26:49,860
and and fast radio bursts and and radio

462
00:26:54,470 --> 00:26:52,559
signals specific frequencies that have

463
00:26:56,390 --> 00:26:54,480
been talked about

464
00:27:00,169 --> 00:26:56,400
um and that's what is being dealt with

465
00:27:04,070 --> 00:27:00,179
in the new version of war the world okay

466
00:27:07,370 --> 00:27:04,080
now the the discovery of this all

467
00:27:09,350 --> 00:27:07,380
happens uh with a radio telescope on the

468
00:27:11,870 --> 00:27:09,360
top of a mountain in the Alps

469
00:27:14,330 --> 00:27:11,880
at I'm not it's not a spoiler alert that

470
00:27:16,490 --> 00:27:14,340
happens in the first episode

471
00:27:22,730 --> 00:27:16,500
but they figure that out

472
00:27:25,010 --> 00:27:22,740
and humans some can hear this frequency

473
00:27:26,870 --> 00:27:25,020
now are they decoding it I'm not going

474
00:27:28,370 --> 00:27:26,880
to get into that or do they are they

475
00:27:30,350 --> 00:27:28,380
communicating I'm not going to get into

476
00:27:31,789 --> 00:27:30,360
any of that what's the [\h__\h] I'm not

477
00:27:33,070 --> 00:27:31,799
going to get into any of that you have

478
00:27:37,549 --> 00:27:33,080
to watch it

479
00:27:41,330 --> 00:27:37,559
but the select humans that can hear it

480
00:27:42,950 --> 00:27:41,340
that's like a warning that these dogs

481
00:27:46,250 --> 00:27:42,960
are near or that something is

482
00:27:48,890 --> 00:27:46,260
approaching from deep space or that and

483
00:27:51,669 --> 00:27:48,900
and that's what goes on in

484
00:27:54,190 --> 00:27:51,679
in our community right

485
00:27:57,470 --> 00:27:54,200
downloading information contact

486
00:28:01,430 --> 00:27:57,480
Consciousness entanglement

487
00:28:02,810 --> 00:28:01,440
um and and is is this something that for

488
00:28:05,590 --> 00:28:02,820
me that I think that the government

489
00:28:09,649 --> 00:28:05,600
knows about they know about frequencies

490
00:28:12,110 --> 00:28:09,659
there was chatter and this is in War of

491
00:28:14,210 --> 00:28:12,120
the World there was chatter in the UFO

492
00:28:16,789 --> 00:28:14,220
community

493
00:28:20,269 --> 00:28:16,799
about six months ago

494
00:28:25,070 --> 00:28:20,279
that the United States Navy specifically

495
00:28:28,549 --> 00:28:25,080
knows an entrance point in the Atlantic

496
00:28:30,169 --> 00:28:28,559
Ocean where some of these UFOs seem to

497
00:28:31,970 --> 00:28:30,179
be coming and going and they know

498
00:28:34,070 --> 00:28:31,980
exactly where it is and they know

499
00:28:36,850 --> 00:28:34,080
exactly where it is

500
00:28:40,070 --> 00:28:36,860
because of frequencies

501
00:28:42,230 --> 00:28:40,080
and I'm watching this unfold I'm not

502
00:28:45,049 --> 00:28:42,240
going to say any more in War of the

503
00:28:48,230 --> 00:28:45,059
Worlds and I'm thinking to myself

504
00:28:50,750 --> 00:28:48,240
is somebody somebody helping them write

505
00:28:52,430 --> 00:28:50,760
this script is this something that is

506
00:28:55,610 --> 00:28:52,440
being fed to the community because it's

507
00:28:58,789 --> 00:28:55,620
being fed to me and I'm picking up on it

508
00:29:02,149 --> 00:28:58,799
and I found it totally interesting

509
00:29:05,750 --> 00:29:02,159
like what is really going on here and

510
00:29:08,390 --> 00:29:05,760
I'm telling you what after uh uh I'm

511
00:29:11,090 --> 00:29:08,400
ready to get Richard in here after you

512
00:29:13,730 --> 00:29:11,100
uh watch War of the Worlds uh the series

513
00:29:15,169 --> 00:29:13,740
and it's three it's three uh three

514
00:29:17,570 --> 00:29:15,179
seasons long now

515
00:29:21,350 --> 00:29:17,580
you will not look at these Boston

516
00:29:22,850 --> 00:29:21,360
Dynamic dogs the same

517
00:29:25,430 --> 00:29:22,860
is there a connection

518
00:29:27,230 --> 00:29:25,440
you gotta check it out you gotta check

519
00:29:29,930 --> 00:29:27,240
it out all right I'm excited this has

520
00:29:33,409 --> 00:29:29,940
been a huge week uh for the UFO

521
00:29:36,230 --> 00:29:33,419
Community uh for uh researchers that

522
00:29:39,590 --> 00:29:36,240
have been at this for a very very long

523
00:29:41,330 --> 00:29:39,600
time and when you least expect it right

524
00:29:43,250 --> 00:29:41,340
we have ebb and flows we have mountains

525
00:29:45,710 --> 00:29:43,260
and valleys in the UFO Community big

526
00:29:48,769 --> 00:29:45,720
things happen get a little lull and then

527
00:29:52,070 --> 00:29:48,779
something else happens right now with

528
00:29:54,889 --> 00:29:52,080
the Wilson Davis document and the things

529
00:29:57,889 --> 00:29:54,899
that have happened to support its

530
00:30:00,590 --> 00:29:57,899
authenticity cannot be ignored this is

531
00:30:03,830 --> 00:30:00,600
exciting we've uh started to put the

532
00:30:06,169 --> 00:30:03,840
pieces of the puzzle together and and

533
00:30:09,049 --> 00:30:06,179
here we are this is a breakthrough

534
00:30:12,409 --> 00:30:09,059
moment we've done two nights this week

535
00:30:14,630 --> 00:30:12,419
uh Grant Cameron on Monday evening last

536
00:30:18,769 --> 00:30:14,640
night I did a complete comprehensive

537
00:30:21,350 --> 00:30:18,779
breakdown of every single page of uh the

538
00:30:25,130 --> 00:30:21,360
document last night we did the

539
00:30:27,169 --> 00:30:25,140
supporting notes of Oak Shannon and Jack

540
00:30:30,950 --> 00:30:27,179
Houck we did that on Monday night

541
00:30:33,769 --> 00:30:30,960
tonight it's Richard Dolan I am your

542
00:30:36,049 --> 00:30:33,779
host Jimmy church this is a show that

543
00:30:39,049 --> 00:30:36,059
you're not going to want to miss and

544
00:30:41,210 --> 00:30:39,059
listen to over and over again I'll be

545
00:30:42,710 --> 00:30:41,220
right back after this short break this

546
00:30:44,810 --> 00:30:42,720
is Fade to Black and The Game Changer

547
00:30:46,909 --> 00:30:44,820
and unex networks

548
00:30:50,570 --> 00:30:46,919
I'm Yours Jimmy church I'll be right

549
00:30:51,710 --> 00:30:50,580
back after this brief message from our

550
00:30:53,350 --> 00:30:51,720
sponsors

551
00:30:56,750 --> 00:30:53,360
stay right there

552
00:30:56,760 --> 00:31:02,280
foreign

553
00:31:02,290 --> 00:31:24,230
[Music]

554
00:31:34,210 --> 00:31:26,540
[Applause]

555
00:31:39,289 --> 00:31:37,130
this is Nicole Church daughter of you

556
00:31:41,630 --> 00:31:39,299
know who and you're listening to fade to

557
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black on jimmychurchradio.com and The

558
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you're listening to Jimmy church and

559
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you're listening to Jimmy Church Fade to

560
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this is Jimmy Church of Fade to Black

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dollars per month all you have to do is

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jimmychurchradio.com hello fadernauts

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607
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there Jimmy Church click on it and get

608
00:34:31,930 --> 00:34:29,450
do you have an interest in the

609
00:34:34,970 --> 00:34:31,940
Paranormal that you'll love the

610
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unexnetwork.com the ax is your streaming

611
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audio and video for everything

612
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Supernatural strange and mysterious like

613
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UFOs Bigfoot ghost and so much more from

614
00:34:49,190 --> 00:34:45,960
hosts like Jimmy Church Whitley strieber

615
00:34:51,770 --> 00:34:49,200
Micah Hanks and Christina Gomez visit

616
00:34:53,629 --> 00:34:51,780
the unexnetwork.com show page for a

617
00:34:56,270 --> 00:34:53,639
complete list of all the Paranormal

618
00:34:58,870 --> 00:34:56,280
programs you'll find on the ax be sure

619
00:35:01,849 --> 00:34:58,880
to follow us on Twitter for updates at

620
00:35:04,970 --> 00:35:01,859
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621
00:35:08,030 --> 00:35:04,980
Network hide the podcast on Spotify I

622
00:35:12,349 --> 00:35:08,040
heart Audible and apple podcast it's

623
00:35:23,329 --> 00:35:13,670
thanks

624
00:35:29,569 --> 00:35:27,170
father's radio show on the game changer

625
00:35:31,849 --> 00:35:29,579
Radio Network

626
00:35:32,930 --> 00:35:31,859
hi this is Rob Reiner from Anvil and

627
00:35:38,470 --> 00:35:32,940
you're listening to Jimmy

628
00:35:57,130 --> 00:35:49,130
[Music]

629
00:36:01,490 --> 00:35:59,810
welcome back

630
00:36:06,290 --> 00:36:01,500
Fade to Black I'm your host Jimmy church

631
00:36:14,329 --> 00:36:10,210
huge week uh for ufology a huge week

632
00:36:17,450 --> 00:36:14,339
just tremendous and tonight is night

633
00:36:20,690 --> 00:36:17,460
three and Richard Dolan is is here

634
00:36:22,670 --> 00:36:20,700
and instead of at this moment I'm gonna

635
00:36:26,089 --> 00:36:22,680
break tradition

636
00:36:28,609 --> 00:36:26,099
I normally read Richard's bio which is

637
00:36:31,910 --> 00:36:28,619
like this long tonight

638
00:36:33,230 --> 00:36:31,920
I'm just gonna say he's a leader he's uh

639
00:36:36,650 --> 00:36:33,240
respected

640
00:36:38,870 --> 00:36:36,660
his website is Richard Dolan members.com

641
00:36:40,970 --> 00:36:38,880
the link is below we have it throughout

642
00:36:43,430 --> 00:36:40,980
social media and I'm just going to get

643
00:36:44,870 --> 00:36:43,440
straight to it man and I'm gonna go how

644
00:36:47,810 --> 00:36:44,880
you doing man

645
00:36:49,490 --> 00:36:47,820
hey Jimmy it's uh always a pleasure and

646
00:36:50,569 --> 00:36:49,500
thank you for skipping the long extended

647
00:36:52,730 --> 00:36:50,579
bio

648
00:36:54,710 --> 00:36:52,740
I think I appreciate that more than

649
00:36:56,210 --> 00:36:54,720
anyone else but I think the listeners

650
00:36:57,770 --> 00:36:56,220
appreciate you skipping it as well so

651
00:37:00,890 --> 00:36:57,780
thank you yeah yeah let's just let's

652
00:37:02,510 --> 00:37:00,900
just get straight to it and uh and and

653
00:37:04,250 --> 00:37:02,520
but I'm not going to break with this

654
00:37:05,930 --> 00:37:04,260
tradition

655
00:37:07,130 --> 00:37:05,940
what was the last piece of music you

656
00:37:09,050 --> 00:37:07,140
listened to today

657
00:37:11,270 --> 00:37:09,060
I was thinking about that because I knew

658
00:37:14,990 --> 00:37:11,280
you would ask me so I actually did not

659
00:37:16,810 --> 00:37:15,000
listen to any music today but I I just

660
00:37:20,510 --> 00:37:16,820
didn't I did listen to music yesterday

661
00:37:22,730 --> 00:37:20,520
okay okay that that okay okay you get a

662
00:37:24,710 --> 00:37:22,740
passion and I know what the last piece

663
00:37:26,750 --> 00:37:24,720
of music that I listen to and I'm gonna

664
00:37:29,630 --> 00:37:26,760
sound like Grandpa Simpson to the young

665
00:37:32,690 --> 00:37:29,640
the young people but I listened to a

666
00:37:41,270 --> 00:37:35,930
remember that's end

667
00:37:47,270 --> 00:37:45,170
yeah like whoa greatest drumming on any

668
00:37:50,450 --> 00:37:47,280
Zeppelin song I mean

669
00:37:52,670 --> 00:37:50,460
such a song it's so emotional too man

670
00:37:54,190 --> 00:37:52,680
you have to just play it Loud it's got

671
00:37:57,170 --> 00:37:54,200
to be played loud

672
00:37:59,510 --> 00:37:57,180
I have Tracy here and I'm playing it and

673
00:38:01,490 --> 00:37:59,520
she was really nice about it she let me

674
00:38:04,250 --> 00:38:01,500
play My Led Zeppelin loud

675
00:38:06,050 --> 00:38:04,260
did I ever tell you the Jethro tell

676
00:38:07,450 --> 00:38:06,060
story that I had with her yeah yeah we

677
00:38:09,770 --> 00:38:07,460
yeah

678
00:38:11,990 --> 00:38:09,780
I'm still getting email about that

679
00:38:13,250 --> 00:38:12,000
Richard so she couldn't let me do songs

680
00:38:16,450 --> 00:38:13,260
from the wood it was she called it

681
00:38:19,010 --> 00:38:16,460
Hobbit rock yeah Hobbit Rock

682
00:38:22,430 --> 00:38:19,020
today the last thing I listened to today

683
00:38:26,329 --> 00:38:22,440
and I thought about this um now I pulled

684
00:38:30,290 --> 00:38:26,339
in and it was lost in Hollywood by

685
00:38:34,010 --> 00:38:30,300
rainbow with a grand Bonnet singing and

686
00:38:35,870 --> 00:38:34,020
uh Richie Blackmore after he left uh

687
00:38:38,870 --> 00:38:35,880
Deep Purple uh started a band called

688
00:38:41,329 --> 00:38:38,880
rainbow uh the original version I

689
00:38:44,150 --> 00:38:41,339
remember yes I remember yes then yes of

690
00:38:46,849 --> 00:38:44,160
course and uh uh the original version

691
00:38:50,870 --> 00:38:46,859
was with a Ronnie James Dio Ronnie left

692
00:38:52,970 --> 00:38:50,880
uh started Dio and Richie brought in uh

693
00:38:56,030 --> 00:38:52,980
Graham Bonnet on vocals and that album

694
00:39:00,370 --> 00:38:56,040
is is tremendous well anyway uh Lost in

695
00:39:03,950 --> 00:39:00,380
Hollywood uh uh by uh

696
00:39:05,450 --> 00:39:03,960
and I listened to it really loud you did

697
00:39:07,670 --> 00:39:05,460
well

698
00:39:09,290 --> 00:39:07,680
um yeah Led Zeppelin uh we're gonna get

699
00:39:13,190 --> 00:39:09,300
we have so much to talk about tonight

700
00:39:16,250 --> 00:39:13,200
but here's the thing uh for me yes Jimmy

701
00:39:18,730 --> 00:39:16,260
Page yes John Paul Jones yes uh you know

702
00:39:21,230 --> 00:39:18,740
Robert Plant I get all of that

703
00:39:25,190 --> 00:39:21,240
John Bonham

704
00:39:26,870 --> 00:39:25,200
the the the way that he held it down

705
00:39:30,589 --> 00:39:26,880
first off

706
00:39:34,550 --> 00:39:30,599
um but they never no click tracks their

707
00:39:37,790 --> 00:39:34,560
Tempo changed you know throughout the

708
00:39:39,950 --> 00:39:37,800
songs uh with the emotion of what was

709
00:39:43,390 --> 00:39:39,960
going on and because those guys played

710
00:39:47,270 --> 00:39:43,400
so long Together live they were able to

711
00:39:49,370 --> 00:39:47,280
uh know when these Temple changes were

712
00:39:52,250 --> 00:39:49,380
going to happen but if you listen really

713
00:39:57,130 --> 00:39:52,260
closely to what's going on that's John

714
00:40:01,730 --> 00:39:59,990
and that particular song In My Time of

715
00:40:03,829 --> 00:40:01,740
Dying I mean I'm sure many listeners

716
00:40:06,230 --> 00:40:03,839
know this song and if you haven't you

717
00:40:08,510 --> 00:40:06,240
gotta listen to it sometime uh he he

718
00:40:10,069 --> 00:40:08,520
just dominates and which is saying

719
00:40:13,190 --> 00:40:10,079
something because everyone on that song

720
00:40:16,430 --> 00:40:13,200
is incredible but he is just

721
00:40:19,970 --> 00:40:16,440
beyond beyond even his amazing level

722
00:40:21,050 --> 00:40:19,980
so you know what I did uh one day I'll

723
00:40:23,329 --> 00:40:21,060
play it

724
00:40:25,370 --> 00:40:23,339
um uh I did this record

725
00:40:27,470 --> 00:40:25,380
where I played everything on it right

726
00:40:31,609 --> 00:40:27,480
okay so I played the guitar bass drums

727
00:40:34,550 --> 00:40:31,619
keyboards and uh and I decided to do a

728
00:40:37,370 --> 00:40:34,560
cover version of No Quarter by Led

729
00:40:38,690 --> 00:40:37,380
Zeppelin that's a good reason yeah it's

730
00:40:40,670 --> 00:40:38,700
got to be one of the most difficult

731
00:40:45,550 --> 00:40:40,680
things but I was like I'm gonna do this

732
00:40:49,790 --> 00:40:45,560
so I decide I'm playing drums right but

733
00:40:52,790 --> 00:40:49,800
you know I'll get through this so I I I

734
00:40:54,950 --> 00:40:52,800
get the drum tracks uh uh bottoms drum

735
00:40:56,510 --> 00:40:54,960
tracks I'm going to imitate them and I

736
00:41:03,109 --> 00:40:56,520
thought

737
00:41:05,810 --> 00:41:03,119
thing uh I could just do one bar and

738
00:41:07,730 --> 00:41:05,820
then I'll cut and paste you know these

739
00:41:10,250 --> 00:41:07,740
sections you know I'll play one more

740
00:41:13,490 --> 00:41:10,260
perfect and I'll just cut and paste you

741
00:41:15,770 --> 00:41:13,500
know the and and I'm going wait a minute

742
00:41:19,010 --> 00:41:15,780
it's falling out of time and then I went

743
00:41:21,470 --> 00:41:19,020
back and analyzed bottom in No Quarter

744
00:41:24,950 --> 00:41:21,480
which is like what 12 minutes long right

745
00:41:27,770 --> 00:41:24,960
yeah really long song he never

746
00:41:30,530 --> 00:41:27,780
repeated a bar there was no two bars

747
00:41:32,329 --> 00:41:30,540
that were alike you go back and you look

748
00:41:36,770 --> 00:41:32,339
I'm like oh my God this is going to take

749
00:41:38,569 --> 00:41:36,780
me forever right to do and uh did you

750
00:41:40,730 --> 00:41:38,579
succeed did you actually do it I I

751
00:41:43,010 --> 00:41:40,740
pulled it off took me a week to do the

752
00:41:44,569 --> 00:41:43,020
drum tracks but here's the thing so wait

753
00:41:46,310 --> 00:41:44,579
you played you played the bass line you

754
00:41:49,069 --> 00:41:46,320
played Jimmy Page's guitar and you

755
00:41:51,710 --> 00:41:49,079
played Bonham's drums yes Robert Plant

756
00:41:55,990 --> 00:41:51,720
and I didn't no I didn't sing I did the

757
00:41:59,630 --> 00:41:56,000
I did the vocals uh with guitar

758
00:42:01,069 --> 00:41:59,640
and the keyboards I I played that with

759
00:42:02,990 --> 00:42:01,079
guitar Tunes well I'll play the tracks

760
00:42:05,990 --> 00:42:03,000
for it it's pretty good but but here's

761
00:42:08,510 --> 00:42:06,000
the thing my respect for Bonham went

762
00:42:11,030 --> 00:42:08,520
through the roof now it you know that's

763
00:42:12,950 --> 00:42:11,040
what opened up we all love them but when

764
00:42:16,390 --> 00:42:12,960
you break it down and you analyze it

765
00:42:19,670 --> 00:42:16,400
like that that dude was a freak man

766
00:42:24,550 --> 00:42:19,680
just yeah you're Way Beyond me I'm not a

767
00:42:29,329 --> 00:42:27,650
I'm auditioning harmonica players for my

768
00:42:31,370 --> 00:42:29,339
new band

769
00:42:34,010 --> 00:42:31,380
yeah I'm a pretty mediocre player so

770
00:42:36,530 --> 00:42:34,020
maybe I'll I'll work for your band

771
00:42:38,690 --> 00:42:36,540
so if I know what key we're in I can I

772
00:42:41,089 --> 00:42:38,700
could maybe you know

773
00:42:42,910 --> 00:42:41,099
not be ultra embarrassing I I won't be

774
00:42:45,829 --> 00:42:42,920
good

775
00:42:47,630 --> 00:42:45,839
if you want someone who's who's really

776
00:42:50,470 --> 00:42:47,640
good at being a mediocre harmonica

777
00:42:54,650 --> 00:42:50,480
player I am your guy

778
00:42:57,650 --> 00:42:54,660
so yeah is that is that the credit on

779
00:43:00,170 --> 00:42:57,660
the album in mediocre harmonica that's

780
00:43:01,329 --> 00:43:00,180
about all I could ever hope for

781
00:43:03,650 --> 00:43:01,339
okay

782
00:43:06,890 --> 00:43:03,660
let's get into it

783
00:43:10,609 --> 00:43:06,900
um the ears here's um I want to back up

784
00:43:13,190 --> 00:43:10,619
uh uh and and like put a little

785
00:43:14,750 --> 00:43:13,200
historical perspective I don't know we

786
00:43:16,060 --> 00:43:14,760
have to stop your room in history is a

787
00:43:18,170 --> 00:43:16,070
little it needs a little work

788
00:43:20,870 --> 00:43:18,180
[Laughter]

789
00:43:24,589 --> 00:43:20,880
your Roman history needs a little work

790
00:43:26,809 --> 00:43:24,599
okay so I'll just very quickly here

791
00:43:28,790 --> 00:43:26,819
Caesar and Pompeii were engaged in a

792
00:43:31,730 --> 00:43:28,800
civil war their armies were killing each

793
00:43:33,829 --> 00:43:31,740
other and Pompey lost now they were

794
00:43:36,170 --> 00:43:33,839
close they had that they had a lot of

795
00:43:38,390 --> 00:43:36,180
they had been political allies with a

796
00:43:40,190 --> 00:43:38,400
rich guy named Crassus uh but things

797
00:43:43,130 --> 00:43:40,200
fell apart as I always did at that

798
00:43:44,630 --> 00:43:43,140
period of time and Pompey lost but um he

799
00:43:46,670 --> 00:43:44,640
did land in Egypt you were right he did

800
00:43:49,430 --> 00:43:46,680
get he was murdered on the spot and that

801
00:43:51,650 --> 00:43:49,440
is because uh the the king or the the

802
00:43:54,410 --> 00:43:51,660
leadership there assumed Caesar would be

803
00:43:55,849 --> 00:43:54,420
happy they actually beheaded him and

804
00:43:58,130 --> 00:43:55,859
Caesar was presented with the head and

805
00:44:00,410 --> 00:43:58,140
he was disgusted and he certainly did

806
00:44:02,930 --> 00:44:00,420
not want that fate for Pompey he had a

807
00:44:05,690 --> 00:44:02,940
lot of uh regard and respect for him but

808
00:44:07,670 --> 00:44:05,700
they were they were no longer

809
00:44:12,650 --> 00:44:07,680
in good with each other they were they

810
00:44:14,870 --> 00:44:12,660
were duking it out I knew I I knew I was

811
00:44:16,970 --> 00:44:14,880
rolling the dice on my historical

812
00:44:18,650 --> 00:44:16,980
knowledge uh with you on the show

813
00:44:20,569 --> 00:44:18,660
tonight thank you for that though yeah

814
00:44:24,589 --> 00:44:20,579
the follow-up uh you know what happened

815
00:44:28,790 --> 00:44:24,599
after that uh Ptolemy uh uh he took

816
00:44:31,609 --> 00:44:28,800
chances and uh you know Pompeii Cassie

817
00:44:34,670 --> 00:44:31,619
here's the thing that that threesome uh

818
00:44:36,710 --> 00:44:34,680
back in Rome uh was pretty tight and

819
00:44:39,230 --> 00:44:36,720
they were technically they were running

820
00:44:43,130 --> 00:44:39,240
uh Italy at the time and running Rome

821
00:44:46,970 --> 00:44:43,140
they absolutely yeah yeah yeah the whole

822
00:44:49,390 --> 00:44:46,980
empire and uh but like I said he got

823
00:44:51,230 --> 00:44:49,400
invited to dinner and he thought that

824
00:44:55,010 --> 00:44:51,240
pompe thought it was a whole other

825
00:44:56,210 --> 00:44:55,020
situation and uh he literally set one

826
00:45:00,130 --> 00:44:56,220
foot on the beach

827
00:45:02,450 --> 00:45:00,140
and uh and that was it that was it

828
00:45:04,250 --> 00:45:02,460
okay so

829
00:45:07,069 --> 00:45:04,260
um historically I want to put some stuff

830
00:45:09,470 --> 00:45:07,079
in perspective here and and for

831
00:45:11,990 --> 00:45:09,480
everybody so they can understand why

832
00:45:16,849 --> 00:45:12,000
this week is such a big deal

833
00:45:18,410 --> 00:45:16,859
um but if we go back uh to you know if

834
00:45:20,390 --> 00:45:18,420
you and I have talked about this many

835
00:45:22,309 --> 00:45:20,400
times before but when Grant had

836
00:45:24,349 --> 00:45:22,319
approached me about these documents at

837
00:45:26,329 --> 00:45:24,359
the conference I didn't know what he was

838
00:45:27,829 --> 00:45:26,339
talking about he wouldn't tell me he was

839
00:45:31,550 --> 00:45:27,839
nervous

840
00:45:33,069 --> 00:45:31,560
um and and then I got at uh Paula Harris

841
00:45:35,450 --> 00:45:33,079
event

842
00:45:39,170 --> 00:45:35,460
conscious life Expo so that would have

843
00:45:44,030 --> 00:45:39,180
been February uh of 2019 I'm guessing

844
00:45:45,050 --> 00:45:44,040
2019. so and then I I had gotten an e

845
00:45:48,410 --> 00:45:45,060
now

846
00:45:51,890 --> 00:45:48,420
that I didn't open uh because I I'm

847
00:45:54,490 --> 00:45:51,900
paranoid about opening emails and and I

848
00:45:58,430 --> 00:45:54,500
just hate it

849
00:46:00,290 --> 00:45:58,440
yeah exactly so Grant tells me this and

850
00:46:02,329 --> 00:46:00,300
then I went back and I'm I'm looking at

851
00:46:03,829 --> 00:46:02,339
my emails and I'm like I got this thing

852
00:46:06,170 --> 00:46:03,839
that's sitting here

853
00:46:08,390 --> 00:46:06,180
uh I'm wondering if there's a connection

854
00:46:11,030 --> 00:46:08,400
and it seemed it could be it was an

855
00:46:14,089 --> 00:46:11,040
anonymous email right

856
00:46:16,190 --> 00:46:14,099
so I end up opening it and and going

857
00:46:20,569 --> 00:46:16,200
through the processes to get to these

858
00:46:24,829 --> 00:46:20,579
files and when I open the file and read

859
00:46:27,170 --> 00:46:24,839
it I called you and that night you and I

860
00:46:30,349 --> 00:46:27,180
you said I got the same email Jimmy

861
00:46:33,190 --> 00:46:30,359
right okay so you and I want page for

862
00:46:36,290 --> 00:46:33,200
page through Wilson Davis

863
00:46:39,170 --> 00:46:36,300
and now this is where I'm going to throw

864
00:46:40,670 --> 00:46:39,180
this out at you because this is my

865
00:46:43,970 --> 00:46:40,680
memory because right after that I called

866
00:46:46,970 --> 00:46:43,980
Grant and he said well maybe it's this

867
00:46:49,910 --> 00:46:46,980
he was being very nervous about the

868
00:46:52,010 --> 00:46:49,920
whole thing right okay so anyway yeah um

869
00:46:55,190 --> 00:46:52,020
when you and I were going through the

870
00:46:57,230 --> 00:46:55,200
pages you said to me

871
00:46:58,849 --> 00:46:57,240
and I'm but this is my memory this is

872
00:47:03,349 --> 00:46:58,859
three years ago so if I'm wrong I'm

873
00:47:04,550 --> 00:47:03,359
wrong but my memory was you said Oak

874
00:47:09,230 --> 00:47:04,560
Shannon

875
00:47:10,609 --> 00:47:09,240
was right and I couldn't fake my way

876
00:47:13,670 --> 00:47:10,619
through the conversation or anything

877
00:47:16,490 --> 00:47:13,680
like that like oh yeah Oak no I didn't

878
00:47:18,710 --> 00:47:16,500
know who Oak Shannon was but that first

879
00:47:20,809 --> 00:47:18,720
conversation that you and I had that

880
00:47:23,030 --> 00:47:20,819
night as we reviewed the the Wilson

881
00:47:25,609 --> 00:47:23,040
Davis document together

882
00:47:28,609 --> 00:47:25,619
um you you mentioned Oak Shannon to me

883
00:47:32,030 --> 00:47:28,619
and that that was uh one of the things

884
00:47:34,370 --> 00:47:32,040
that was raising your eyebrow on this

885
00:47:36,530 --> 00:47:34,380
document well let me be a little more

886
00:47:38,329 --> 00:47:36,540
yeah that you're close

887
00:47:40,550 --> 00:47:38,339
um

888
00:47:42,950 --> 00:47:40,560
I did I did know who Oak Shannon was

889
00:47:45,290 --> 00:47:42,960
through uh because I had studied the uh

890
00:47:48,109 --> 00:47:45,300
the whole his not the whole history but

891
00:47:49,609 --> 00:47:48,119
a little bit of John Alexander's excuse

892
00:47:51,950 --> 00:47:49,619
me advanced theoretical physics group

893
00:47:53,569 --> 00:47:51,960
from the 1980s Oak Shannon was part of

894
00:47:55,430 --> 00:47:53,579
that that's a really interesting thing

895
00:47:56,630 --> 00:47:55,440
and we should talk a bit about that by

896
00:47:57,530 --> 00:47:56,640
the way

897
00:48:00,470 --> 00:47:57,540
um

898
00:48:03,349 --> 00:48:00,480
but no it was Grant had talked to me

899
00:48:05,930 --> 00:48:03,359
about this a little earlier and he had

900
00:48:09,170 --> 00:48:05,940
said granted said to me

901
00:48:11,809 --> 00:48:09,180
that as soon as he saw Oak Shannon's

902
00:48:14,510 --> 00:48:11,819
name on

903
00:48:16,730 --> 00:48:14,520
uh I think is page one page two of those

904
00:48:19,790 --> 00:48:16,740
notes pages one and two actually yeah

905
00:48:22,910 --> 00:48:19,800
pages one and two yeah grant grant had

906
00:48:24,650 --> 00:48:22,920
said to me like I knew immediately I I

907
00:48:27,589 --> 00:48:24,660
knew immediately that this was very very

908
00:48:28,670 --> 00:48:27,599
important and and the real thing

909
00:48:30,589 --> 00:48:28,680
um

910
00:48:32,870 --> 00:48:30,599
and uh I think that impressed me and

911
00:48:35,210 --> 00:48:32,880
when I thought about it I I thought yeah

912
00:48:37,370 --> 00:48:35,220
I can understand that absolutely so that

913
00:48:40,790 --> 00:48:37,380
might be what I said to you

914
00:48:42,410 --> 00:48:40,800
um my my reaction I'll just mention this

915
00:48:44,270 --> 00:48:42,420
and as I've I've said to you I've said

916
00:48:45,589 --> 00:48:44,280
to the whole world at this point I was

917
00:48:48,170 --> 00:48:45,599
shown

918
00:48:49,309 --> 00:48:48,180
uh I don't remember if it was two I

919
00:48:50,990 --> 00:48:49,319
don't remember if it was three I was

920
00:48:54,470 --> 00:48:51,000
shown two or three of those pages of

921
00:48:57,470 --> 00:48:54,480
those notes back in 2006.

922
00:48:59,089 --> 00:48:57,480
and um I was not shown the first few

923
00:49:01,750 --> 00:48:59,099
pages I was only shown toward the end

924
00:49:05,030 --> 00:49:01,760
and the part that I would never forget

925
00:49:07,609 --> 00:49:05,040
was the uh statement that Wilson had

926
00:49:10,130 --> 00:49:07,619
said to Davis that the material that the

927
00:49:12,829 --> 00:49:10,140
contractors had was not made by man not

928
00:49:13,730 --> 00:49:12,839
uh human hands not not of this Earth and

929
00:49:16,010 --> 00:49:13,740
um

930
00:49:18,290 --> 00:49:16,020
and in the situation that I was in and I

931
00:49:19,670 --> 00:49:18,300
I as I've said again many times I will

932
00:49:21,470 --> 00:49:19,680
not give up the identity of this person

933
00:49:24,290 --> 00:49:21,480
but it was someone very close to the

934
00:49:26,630 --> 00:49:24,300
entire situation in a perfect position

935
00:49:27,890 --> 00:49:26,640
to have all of this I'll just leave it

936
00:49:29,630 --> 00:49:27,900
at that

937
00:49:31,849 --> 00:49:29,640
um I wasn't in a position where I could

938
00:49:34,430 --> 00:49:31,859
take a photograph of anything I was

939
00:49:36,170 --> 00:49:34,440
asked not to take notes at the time in

940
00:49:39,349 --> 00:49:36,180
all of this it was like a favor

941
00:49:42,890 --> 00:49:39,359
but I was shown for my own edification

942
00:49:45,410 --> 00:49:42,900
so um I got I got the and and I got a

943
00:49:46,970 --> 00:49:45,420
verbal uh an oral kind of background of

944
00:49:48,829 --> 00:49:46,980
the whole thing by this individual I

945
00:49:50,809 --> 00:49:48,839
should mention that as well

946
00:49:53,150 --> 00:49:50,819
and so with that information I tried

947
00:49:56,210 --> 00:49:53,160
contacting uh Thomas Wilson myself and I

948
00:49:57,829 --> 00:49:56,220
did I reached him uh he hung up very

949
00:49:59,030 --> 00:49:57,839
abruptly once he found out what I was

950
00:50:01,550 --> 00:49:59,040
calling for

951
00:50:02,930 --> 00:50:01,560
uh talk to Stephen Greer about it or not

952
00:50:04,130 --> 00:50:02,940
to Greer directly I talked to one of his

953
00:50:05,450 --> 00:50:04,140
people about it I talked to Edgar

954
00:50:07,130 --> 00:50:05,460
Mitchell about it

955
00:50:08,990 --> 00:50:07,140
uh talked to a couple of other people

956
00:50:10,730 --> 00:50:09,000
who knew about this

957
00:50:14,690 --> 00:50:10,740
and then I just started talking about it

958
00:50:17,750 --> 00:50:14,700
to the world uh in 2007 2008 2009 for a

959
00:50:20,329 --> 00:50:17,760
few years and I never mentioned that I

960
00:50:22,609 --> 00:50:20,339
actually saw uh notes and I never said

961
00:50:25,309 --> 00:50:22,619
that ever until on I was on your program

962
00:50:28,490 --> 00:50:25,319
back in December of 2018 that was the

963
00:50:29,390 --> 00:50:28,500
first time that I ever actually said I

964
00:50:32,809 --> 00:50:29,400
saw

965
00:50:33,950 --> 00:50:32,819
written down notes at that point I had

966
00:50:36,530 --> 00:50:33,960
no idea that those notes were

967
00:50:38,089 --> 00:50:36,540
circulating which they were quietly let

968
00:50:39,890 --> 00:50:38,099
me let me jump in because that's

969
00:50:42,109 --> 00:50:39,900
actually a very significant point

970
00:50:45,190 --> 00:50:42,119
because

971
00:50:48,170 --> 00:50:45,200
um yes what your answer to the question

972
00:50:51,609 --> 00:50:48,180
uh specifically about these documents is

973
00:50:55,730 --> 00:50:51,619
key but it was my question

974
00:50:59,089 --> 00:50:55,740
that caused the answer and my question

975
00:51:01,490 --> 00:50:59,099
to you was uh Richard give me the secret

976
00:51:05,390 --> 00:51:01,500
stuff what's the one I'm paraphrasing

977
00:51:08,390 --> 00:51:05,400
what's the one thing for Richard Dolan

978
00:51:10,370 --> 00:51:08,400
about the UFO question what what's that

979
00:51:12,470 --> 00:51:10,380
and you said Jimmy yes and you said the

980
00:51:14,210 --> 00:51:12,480
one thing that I'd never shared that

981
00:51:16,309 --> 00:51:14,220
that you never shared you wanted

982
00:51:20,569 --> 00:51:16,319
something new yeah that's right that's

983
00:51:23,809 --> 00:51:20,579
right so and that that's when you I did

984
00:51:26,030 --> 00:51:23,819
pull it out but that was and your answer

985
00:51:30,770 --> 00:51:26,040
was

986
00:51:33,290 --> 00:51:30,780
notes

987
00:51:35,690 --> 00:51:33,300
detailing an interview that was done of

988
00:51:37,010 --> 00:51:35,700
Thomas of um yeah of Admiral Thomas

989
00:51:38,870 --> 00:51:37,020
Wilson

990
00:51:39,650 --> 00:51:38,880
I don't think I mentioned Eric Davis by

991
00:51:41,150 --> 00:51:39,660
name

992
00:51:43,069 --> 00:51:41,160
um but I just said I mentioned these

993
00:51:44,450 --> 00:51:43,079
notes and it was relating to Thomas

994
00:51:47,210 --> 00:51:44,460
Wilson

995
00:51:48,710 --> 00:51:47,220
and um

996
00:51:51,109 --> 00:51:48,720
that was it was an interview that was

997
00:51:53,030 --> 00:51:51,119
done to him after the fact after he had

998
00:51:55,390 --> 00:51:53,040
failed to get access to uh this black

999
00:51:58,130 --> 00:51:55,400
budget program that was dealing with

1000
00:52:00,109 --> 00:51:58,140
reverse engineering of alien Tech

1001
00:52:02,270 --> 00:52:00,119
and that he was denied access

1002
00:52:03,950 --> 00:52:02,280
so that part I'd always talked about but

1003
00:52:06,349 --> 00:52:03,960
I just never said that I'd seen the

1004
00:52:08,089 --> 00:52:06,359
notes and I I never said it because that

1005
00:52:09,290 --> 00:52:08,099
was a favor to the person who showed

1006
00:52:12,349 --> 00:52:09,300
them to me

1007
00:52:14,930 --> 00:52:12,359
and but at the point when you asked me

1008
00:52:16,970 --> 00:52:14,940
it had now been

1009
00:52:20,990 --> 00:52:16,980
um 14 years

1010
00:52:22,430 --> 00:52:21,000
no uh sorry 12 12 years 12 years yeah

1011
00:52:24,170 --> 00:52:22,440
and um

1012
00:52:27,170 --> 00:52:24,180
I just thought you know what I'm tired

1013
00:52:28,910 --> 00:52:27,180
of not saying this anymore so uh it was

1014
00:52:30,589 --> 00:52:28,920
a spur of the moment decision on my part

1015
00:52:32,510 --> 00:52:30,599
that I that I was just going to mention

1016
00:52:34,549 --> 00:52:32,520
I saw the notes and I had no idea that

1017
00:52:36,170 --> 00:52:34,559
at that very time Grant Cameron was

1018
00:52:37,910 --> 00:52:36,180
actually in possession of them and a

1019
00:52:40,250 --> 00:52:37,920
number of other people uh Australian

1020
00:52:41,150 --> 00:52:40,260
James rigney of course and um a few

1021
00:52:43,190 --> 00:52:41,160
others

1022
00:52:44,329 --> 00:52:43,200
I don't know who sent me those notes by

1023
00:52:46,370 --> 00:52:44,339
the way I don't know if you know who

1024
00:52:48,710 --> 00:52:46,380
sent you yours but I I actually do not

1025
00:52:50,390 --> 00:52:48,720
know the identity of the person no I

1026
00:52:53,030 --> 00:52:50,400
don't I don't either

1027
00:52:54,829 --> 00:52:53,040
um I've been there's been a few people

1028
00:52:56,690 --> 00:52:54,839
that have said that they sent them to me

1029
00:52:58,670 --> 00:52:56,700
and that's when I've just backed off and

1030
00:53:02,569 --> 00:52:58,680
went well okay somebody here's not

1031
00:53:04,309 --> 00:53:02,579
telling the truth so I I I don't know I

1032
00:53:06,290 --> 00:53:04,319
actually went back and tried to find the

1033
00:53:08,630 --> 00:53:06,300
original email

1034
00:53:12,470 --> 00:53:08,640
um I've got three different archives of

1035
00:53:14,030 --> 00:53:12,480
emails uh from different servers and I

1036
00:53:16,309 --> 00:53:14,040
haven't been able to find it but I do

1037
00:53:18,109 --> 00:53:16,319
remember it was Anonymous so anybody

1038
00:53:19,790 --> 00:53:18,119
could like into it at this point

1039
00:53:22,010 --> 00:53:19,800
probably the same person whoever sent it

1040
00:53:24,349 --> 00:53:22,020
to you undoubtedly sent it to me yeah

1041
00:53:26,089 --> 00:53:24,359
yeah yeah well it was it was it was it

1042
00:53:28,370 --> 00:53:26,099
was too coincidental

1043
00:53:32,210 --> 00:53:28,380
um and it was the same processes too as

1044
00:53:35,510 --> 00:53:32,220
well I remember there was uh uh a couple

1045
00:53:38,690 --> 00:53:35,520
of security things that had to uh to go

1046
00:53:40,790 --> 00:53:38,700
through to access the files and uh I

1047
00:53:42,410 --> 00:53:40,800
remember that but um Tracy found my I

1048
00:53:43,970 --> 00:53:42,420
would never see it on my own Tracy found

1049
00:53:45,589 --> 00:53:43,980
it thank goodness but I didn't remember

1050
00:53:48,470 --> 00:53:45,599
any security

1051
00:53:50,990 --> 00:53:48,480
um yeah I can't say that Anonymous

1052
00:53:53,750 --> 00:53:51,000
proton account yeah that's that's that's

1053
00:53:55,930 --> 00:53:53,760
what it was I do remember that

1054
00:53:59,890 --> 00:53:55,940
um uh okay so

1055
00:54:04,130 --> 00:53:59,900
let's there's another part to this

1056
00:54:06,890 --> 00:54:04,140
most don't understand uh your background

1057
00:54:09,770 --> 00:54:06,900
with the Wilson Davis document that goes

1058
00:54:11,450 --> 00:54:09,780
back now you know 12 years prior uh to

1059
00:54:13,790 --> 00:54:11,460
all of this

1060
00:54:16,730 --> 00:54:13,800
um but you you made those statements

1061
00:54:18,470 --> 00:54:16,740
very early on uh and I'm going to

1062
00:54:21,230 --> 00:54:18,480
paraphrase so you're here with me if you

1063
00:54:22,730 --> 00:54:21,240
want to correct me but you had said very

1064
00:54:26,270 --> 00:54:22,740
publicly

1065
00:54:28,609 --> 00:54:26,280
um on this program and others that this

1066
00:54:31,609 --> 00:54:28,619
could be the most important UFO document

1067
00:54:33,589 --> 00:54:31,619
of the century

1068
00:54:35,750 --> 00:54:33,599
um and you got a lot of flack you got a

1069
00:54:38,030 --> 00:54:35,760
lot of flack for that but you stuck you

1070
00:54:40,790 --> 00:54:38,040
stuck by it and and here we are today

1071
00:54:43,670 --> 00:54:40,800
well it looks like that that is exactly

1072
00:54:47,390 --> 00:54:43,680
the case but you chose to stick to your

1073
00:54:51,170 --> 00:54:47,400
guns and and taking such a strong

1074
00:54:53,510 --> 00:54:51,180
position uh on a document uh is is

1075
00:54:57,049 --> 00:54:53,520
profound what made you do that so

1076
00:54:59,089 --> 00:54:57,059
quickly out of the gate thank you yeah

1077
00:55:00,770 --> 00:54:59,099
um I appreciate you saying that by the

1078
00:55:03,770 --> 00:55:00,780
way

1079
00:55:05,870 --> 00:55:03,780
um well a i there is not a shred of

1080
00:55:07,849 --> 00:55:05,880
doubt in my mind of their authenticity

1081
00:55:10,970 --> 00:55:07,859
it was not a shred of doubt

1082
00:55:13,130 --> 00:55:10,980
so that you know all there were a lot of

1083
00:55:14,809 --> 00:55:13,140
people who um acted as if they really

1084
00:55:17,089 --> 00:55:14,819
knew what they were talking about on

1085
00:55:17,990 --> 00:55:17,099
these these notes and they clearly did

1086
00:55:21,530 --> 00:55:18,000
not

1087
00:55:23,690 --> 00:55:21,540
and I knew uh there's a lot of a lot of

1088
00:55:25,370 --> 00:55:23,700
things in our field and in many fields

1089
00:55:26,690 --> 00:55:25,380
where that it will take a long time for

1090
00:55:28,970 --> 00:55:26,700
the truth to come out sometimes the

1091
00:55:31,490 --> 00:55:28,980
truth gets buried I just knew I thought

1092
00:55:34,490 --> 00:55:31,500
in this case these notes I know they are

1093
00:55:36,170 --> 00:55:34,500
real they will be Vindicated and and I

1094
00:55:39,829 --> 00:55:36,180
felt an obligation to be honest with you

1095
00:55:41,690 --> 00:55:39,839
to uh to stand up and defend them

1096
00:55:44,450 --> 00:55:41,700
and for a while I'm just going to say

1097
00:55:47,270 --> 00:55:44,460
not many people were defending them uh

1098
00:55:49,549 --> 00:55:47,280
Grant certainly did but he he didn't

1099
00:55:51,170 --> 00:55:49,559
really want to be out there and he had

1100
00:55:52,069 --> 00:55:51,180
said this he did put himself out there

1101
00:55:53,930 --> 00:55:52,079
but

1102
00:55:54,650 --> 00:55:53,940
I just felt that

1103
00:55:57,290 --> 00:55:54,660
um

1104
00:55:59,569 --> 00:55:57,300
they needed a standard Bearer if I I

1105
00:56:02,630 --> 00:55:59,579
could put it that way

1106
00:56:03,950 --> 00:56:02,640
and I was willing to take the hits I

1107
00:56:06,290 --> 00:56:03,960
didn't care

1108
00:56:08,569 --> 00:56:06,300
um I had a few people a few very good

1109
00:56:09,890 --> 00:56:08,579
behind the scenes researchers helping me

1110
00:56:13,130 --> 00:56:09,900
personally and then there were other

1111
00:56:15,530 --> 00:56:13,140
researchers that I came to know or

1112
00:56:17,210 --> 00:56:15,540
communicate with who did even more

1113
00:56:20,690 --> 00:56:17,220
incredible work I think of someone like

1114
00:56:22,670 --> 00:56:20,700
Giuliano Marinkovic who is um

1115
00:56:25,250 --> 00:56:22,680
very behind the scenes but he put

1116
00:56:28,730 --> 00:56:25,260
together a document that is simply

1117
00:56:31,730 --> 00:56:28,740
outstanding and he uh listed all of the

1118
00:56:32,750 --> 00:56:31,740
references to the Wilson scenario The

1119
00:56:35,329 --> 00:56:32,760
Saga

1120
00:56:37,970 --> 00:56:35,339
uh starting right from the 1990s and uh

1121
00:56:40,790 --> 00:56:37,980
all the way through and he he found uh I

1122
00:56:42,349 --> 00:56:40,800
don't know how he did this most of my

1123
00:56:44,450 --> 00:56:42,359
own statements on it I don't know if he

1124
00:56:47,030 --> 00:56:44,460
got all of them they got most of them uh

1125
00:56:50,270 --> 00:56:47,040
that I had made in 0708 and all of those

1126
00:56:52,970 --> 00:56:50,280
years Edgar Mitchell Stephen Greer

1127
00:56:54,950 --> 00:56:52,980
uh will Miller he found them all and he

1128
00:56:57,290 --> 00:56:54,960
just put them all together on this

1129
00:56:59,210 --> 00:56:57,300
massive list and it's still available

1130
00:57:01,010 --> 00:56:59,220
uh I'm not trying to plug my YouTube

1131
00:57:03,890 --> 00:57:01,020
channel but I did a I did a program on

1132
00:57:06,470 --> 00:57:03,900
this yesterday last night and uh in the

1133
00:57:08,630 --> 00:57:06,480
um uh the com not in the comments in my

1134
00:57:11,270 --> 00:57:08,640
notes I have links to his article people

1135
00:57:13,549 --> 00:57:11,280
should check it out it's uh it's truly

1136
00:57:16,730 --> 00:57:13,559
outstanding so there there were a lot of

1137
00:57:19,549 --> 00:57:16,740
very good people doing work uh

1138
00:57:21,230 --> 00:57:19,559
validating these notes and I knew that

1139
00:57:24,109 --> 00:57:21,240
their the work was strong enough that

1140
00:57:26,569 --> 00:57:24,119
this would eventually it would win

1141
00:57:27,770 --> 00:57:26,579
so I am seeing now that I think uh the

1142
00:57:29,089 --> 00:57:27,780
community is

1143
00:57:30,650 --> 00:57:29,099
some of these people I don't know if

1144
00:57:34,010 --> 00:57:30,660
they're grudgingly doing it but they're

1145
00:57:37,190 --> 00:57:34,020
they're I think we're seeing a a broad

1146
00:57:38,690 --> 00:57:37,200
consensus that yes these notes are legit

1147
00:57:40,430 --> 00:57:38,700
and that's good we need to go much

1148
00:57:42,230 --> 00:57:40,440
farther than that because the notes

1149
00:57:45,890 --> 00:57:42,240
themselves need to be studied and

1150
00:57:49,130 --> 00:57:45,900
understood and the implications of these

1151
00:57:50,329 --> 00:57:49,140
notes are critically important and may I

1152
00:57:53,630 --> 00:57:50,339
just mentioned

1153
00:57:55,370 --> 00:57:53,640
um you mentioned Oak Shannon and uh I

1154
00:57:57,770 --> 00:57:55,380
really owe a thanks to Melinda Leslie

1155
00:58:00,349 --> 00:57:57,780
who uh sent me some information on this

1156
00:58:02,390 --> 00:58:00,359
and she directed me to the work done by

1157
00:58:05,089 --> 00:58:02,400
Isaac Coy who actually has been doing

1158
00:58:06,290 --> 00:58:05,099
research in UFOs for many many years I

1159
00:58:09,109 --> 00:58:06,300
used to read a lot of his stuff that was

1160
00:58:10,849 --> 00:58:09,119
on Above Top Secret he's got elsewhere

1161
00:58:14,390 --> 00:58:10,859
that he puts his information out I guess

1162
00:58:17,329 --> 00:58:14,400
but he um I think was he the one who

1163
00:58:19,430 --> 00:58:17,339
found this so there were notes in the

1164
00:58:21,530 --> 00:58:19,440
um there are 26 pages of notes I think

1165
00:58:23,870 --> 00:58:21,540
Oak Shannon and I think Jack Houk

1166
00:58:26,870 --> 00:58:23,880
together had notes that were published

1167
00:58:30,049 --> 00:58:26,880
now these both of these men

1168
00:58:32,450 --> 00:58:30,059
uh attended John Alexander's Advanced

1169
00:58:34,069 --> 00:58:32,460
theoretical physics

1170
00:58:36,710 --> 00:58:34,079
um group

1171
00:58:38,150 --> 00:58:36,720
back in the 1980s and I'm sure some

1172
00:58:41,390 --> 00:58:38,160
listeners know but for those who don't

1173
00:58:42,710 --> 00:58:41,400
this was John Alexander who was within

1174
00:58:45,410 --> 00:58:42,720
the US Army at the time started

1175
00:58:47,329 --> 00:58:45,420
basically a UFO group uh was it was

1176
00:58:48,109 --> 00:58:47,339
written about by Howard bloom in a book

1177
00:58:48,710 --> 00:58:48,119
called

1178
00:58:51,289 --> 00:58:48,720
um

1179
00:58:53,210 --> 00:58:51,299
that was that called out there

1180
00:58:54,950 --> 00:58:53,220
he called it the UFO study group but it

1181
00:58:57,650 --> 00:58:54,960
was the advanced theoretical physics

1182
00:59:00,530 --> 00:58:57,660
group anyway this was a kind of a UFO

1183
00:59:02,329 --> 00:59:00,540
research project that he organized how

1184
00:59:05,990 --> 00:59:02,339
putoff was in it Kate green was in it

1185
00:59:08,150 --> 00:59:06,000
Bob Wood was in it uh Jack Houck and

1186
00:59:09,530 --> 00:59:08,160
Oak Shannon we're in it and others as

1187
00:59:11,870 --> 00:59:09,540
well

1188
00:59:16,190 --> 00:59:11,880
so in Shannon's notes

1189
00:59:20,569 --> 00:59:16,200
there is a reference to ATP 10 Advanced

1190
00:59:22,670 --> 00:59:20,579
theoretical physics group uh 10

1191
00:59:29,329 --> 00:59:22,680
and

1192
00:59:33,109 --> 00:59:29,339
this is a direct reference he says you

1193
00:59:36,109 --> 00:59:33,119
know Oak Shannon ap10 BDM and that

1194
00:59:39,410 --> 00:59:36,119
referred to the the medium McLean secure

1195
00:59:41,630 --> 00:59:39,420
facility where they met and so

1196
00:59:44,329 --> 00:59:41,640
I just think it's a very significant

1197
00:59:46,730 --> 00:59:44,339
connection here that these notes that

1198
00:59:48,950 --> 00:59:46,740
was a really great catch

1199
00:59:51,770 --> 00:59:48,960
that's just another it's like these

1200
00:59:54,109 --> 00:59:51,780
pieces of a puzzle fitting perfectly

1201
00:59:55,730 --> 00:59:54,119
together this is not something that

1202
00:59:56,870 --> 00:59:55,740
would happen as coincidence or by chance

1203
00:59:58,609 --> 00:59:56,880
it's

1204
01:00:01,849 --> 00:59:58,619
and there's so many there's a lot of

1205
01:00:03,890 --> 01:00:01,859
those things in Davis's notes that I

1206
01:00:06,049 --> 01:00:03,900
think we have to be beyond the point

1207
01:00:08,809 --> 01:00:06,059
where we're questioning the authenticity

1208
01:00:10,549 --> 01:00:08,819
of these notes it's ridiculous uh even I

1209
01:00:12,230 --> 01:00:10,559
think at this point to do so I thought

1210
01:00:15,109 --> 01:00:12,240
it was ridiculous three years ago to do

1211
01:00:16,490 --> 01:00:15,119
so but I think it's uh absurd now to be

1212
01:00:19,010 --> 01:00:16,500
questioning their authenticity at this

1213
01:00:20,809 --> 01:00:19,020
point yeah I mean Wilson hasn't uh

1214
01:00:23,210 --> 01:00:20,819
authenticated and why would he how could

1215
01:00:26,990 --> 01:00:23,220
he it's impossible for him to he could

1216
01:00:29,210 --> 01:00:27,000
never ever he says in 2006 when I called

1217
01:00:31,730 --> 01:00:29,220
him who called him anyway but it's not

1218
01:00:34,430 --> 01:00:31,740
like like there are people how do you

1219
01:00:36,349 --> 01:00:34,440
just accept a denial like that at face

1220
01:00:37,849 --> 01:00:36,359
value and think okay well he says no so

1221
01:00:38,829 --> 01:00:37,859
I'm just going to walk away and yet

1222
01:00:40,430 --> 01:00:38,839
they're

1223
01:00:42,049 --> 01:00:40,440
journalists

1224
01:00:43,670 --> 01:00:42,059
who did this

1225
01:00:44,930 --> 01:00:43,680
and I'm not even going to get into names

1226
01:00:46,370 --> 01:00:44,940
I don't really want to get into fights

1227
01:00:48,289 --> 01:00:46,380
but I just think it's

1228
01:00:51,250 --> 01:00:48,299
how do you do that how do you just

1229
01:00:53,450 --> 01:00:51,260
accept a done I like that at face value

1230
01:00:57,829 --> 01:00:53,460
I got to take a break right here but

1231
01:01:00,770 --> 01:00:57,839
what is is is funny to me is that exact

1232
01:01:02,109 --> 01:01:00,780
scenario is in the notes where Davis

1233
01:01:09,950 --> 01:01:02,119
says

1234
01:01:12,589 --> 01:01:09,960
leak of this I'm out I will deny

1235
01:01:15,650 --> 01:01:12,599
everything I will deny knowing you I

1236
01:01:18,230 --> 01:01:15,660
will deny talking to you and that's in

1237
01:01:20,690 --> 01:01:18,240
the notes and and he's stuck to exactly

1238
01:01:23,390 --> 01:01:20,700
what he said he was going to do not

1239
01:01:25,750 --> 01:01:23,400
knowing Oh Shannon yes he denied knowing

1240
01:01:28,309 --> 01:01:25,760
again let's take our break right here

1241
01:01:29,870 --> 01:01:28,319
we're gonna go straight there when we

1242
01:01:31,010 --> 01:01:29,880
come back this is Fade to Black our

1243
01:01:35,329 --> 01:01:31,020
guest tonight the one and only Richard

1244
01:01:37,150 --> 01:01:35,339
Dolan it is tonight Wilson Davis Knight

1245
01:01:39,349 --> 01:01:37,160
three

1246
01:01:41,089 --> 01:01:39,359
bombshell week here on Fade to Black I'm

1247
01:01:42,530 --> 01:01:41,099
Yours Jimmy Church stay right there

1248
01:01:46,970 --> 01:01:42,540
we'll be right back after this short

1249
01:01:46,980 --> 01:02:09,370
[Music]

1250
01:02:16,809 --> 01:02:12,470
this is baby black with Jimmy Church on

1251
01:02:24,589 --> 01:02:19,730
your one million gigawatt paranormal

1252
01:02:29,990 --> 01:02:26,690
hello fader Knights Jimmy church here

1253
01:02:32,270 --> 01:02:30,000
you've seen me with my thunderstorm now

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1255
01:02:36,829 --> 01:02:34,559
get healthy clean fresh smelling air and

1256
01:02:38,690 --> 01:02:36,839
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1257
01:02:41,450 --> 01:02:38,700
here in the bunker the Eden Pier

1258
01:02:43,789 --> 01:02:41,460
thunderstorm uses oxy technology that

1259
01:02:46,130 --> 01:02:43,799
naturally sends out O3 molecules into

1260
01:02:48,349 --> 01:02:46,140
the air which seek out odors and air

1261
01:02:50,750 --> 01:02:48,359
pollutants in your home and destroys

1262
01:02:53,630 --> 01:02:50,760
them it's called a thunderstorm because

1263
01:02:55,970 --> 01:02:53,640
it purifies the air just like after a

1264
01:02:58,789 --> 01:02:55,980
thunderstorm and right now you can save

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1270
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use fader 3. shipping is free and it's

1271
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easy just scroll down you'll see my name

1272
01:03:24,049 --> 01:03:20,940
right there Jimmy Church click on it and

1273
01:03:26,870 --> 01:03:24,059
get your deal today that's EdenPURE

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1275
01:03:32,150 --> 01:03:30,140
this is Billy Carson founder and CEO of

1276
01:03:34,430 --> 01:03:32,160
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1277
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dot TV is the fastest growing in one of

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1290
01:04:09,370 --> 01:04:08,089
because you never got that pony you

1291
01:04:13,370 --> 01:04:09,380
always wanted

1292
01:04:16,670 --> 01:04:13,380
damn it Jimmy church and Fade to Black

1293
01:04:20,210 --> 01:04:16,680
on the game changer Network

1294
01:04:22,250 --> 01:04:20,220
listen I know and you know that you've

1295
01:04:24,650 --> 01:04:22,260
always wanted your first crystal skull

1296
01:04:26,990 --> 01:04:24,660
or maybe you're a collector just like me

1297
01:04:29,930 --> 01:04:27,000
but you just don't know where to go to

1298
01:04:31,789 --> 01:04:29,940
find the real thing then I met Carolyn

1299
01:04:34,910 --> 01:04:31,799
Ford over at Einstein the crystal

1300
01:04:36,890 --> 01:04:34,920
skull.com Carolyn is the guardian of

1301
01:04:39,650 --> 01:04:36,900
Einstein one of the most respected

1302
01:04:41,630 --> 01:04:39,660
ancient crystal skulls in the world all

1303
01:04:43,670 --> 01:04:41,640
of her unique skulls have been imprinted

1304
01:04:45,710 --> 01:04:43,680
sitting with Einstein in his sacred

1305
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1306
01:04:50,690 --> 01:04:48,599
gemstone and materials imprinting is the

1307
01:04:53,770 --> 01:04:50,700
process of receiving the ancient wisdom

1308
01:04:57,109 --> 01:04:53,780
from the master skull or Master computer

1309
01:04:58,609 --> 01:04:57,119
Einstein the ancient Crystal Skull to

1310
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see Carolyn's current collection of

1311
01:05:03,890 --> 01:05:00,960
crystal skulls just visit her store at

1312
01:05:06,170 --> 01:05:03,900
Einstein the crystalskull.com or click

1313
01:05:08,569 --> 01:05:06,180
on the banner over on our site don't

1314
01:05:11,210 --> 01:05:08,579
forget to use the promo code Jimmy at

1315
01:05:14,809 --> 01:05:11,220
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1316
01:05:17,150 --> 01:05:14,819
today that's promo code Jimmy finding

1317
01:05:28,430 --> 01:05:17,160
your first or next Crystal Skull is easy

1318
01:05:32,150 --> 01:05:30,410
this is Ray shops here repping the

1319
01:05:35,400 --> 01:05:32,160
planet and you're listening to my good

1320
01:05:36,950 --> 01:05:35,410
friend Jimmy Church Fade to Black

1321
01:05:38,930 --> 01:05:36,960
[Music]

1322
01:05:41,750 --> 01:05:38,940
Sophie cable you're listening to

1323
01:05:44,569 --> 01:05:41,760
jimmychurch radio.com don't hurt me

1324
01:05:46,910 --> 01:05:44,579
Jimmy I'm only little hey I'm Adrian

1325
01:05:48,980 --> 01:05:46,920
greniere and this is Ari Gold we're the

1326
01:05:53,230 --> 01:05:48,990
honey Brothers

1327
01:05:59,329 --> 01:05:56,030
we're the honey brothers and you're

1328
01:06:01,010 --> 01:05:59,339
listening to Jim Church a revolution

1329
01:06:03,049 --> 01:06:01,020
this is Jimmy Church of Fade to Black

1330
01:06:05,030 --> 01:06:03,059
and you can become an official fate or

1331
01:06:07,030 --> 01:06:05,040
Not by just going to our membership

1332
01:06:10,370 --> 01:06:07,040
section at

1333
01:06:12,289 --> 01:06:10,380
jimmychurchradio.com hello this is

1334
01:06:14,690 --> 01:06:12,299
Serena Wright Taylor from conscious life

1335
01:06:16,910 --> 01:06:14,700
Expo and you're listening to fade to

1336
01:06:18,710 --> 01:06:16,920
black with Jimmy Church who holds the

1337
01:06:22,190 --> 01:06:18,720
lucky pony record for the best

1338
01:06:23,349 --> 01:06:22,200
astrological chart since 1963. true

1339
01:06:25,849 --> 01:06:23,359
story

1340
01:06:27,289 --> 01:06:25,859
this is Micah Hanks of the Grayling

1341
01:06:35,150 --> 01:06:27,299
report and you're listening to Jimmy

1342
01:06:35,160 --> 01:06:45,660
foreign

1343
01:06:55,190 --> 01:06:51,010
[Music]

1344
01:06:57,349 --> 01:06:55,200
church tonight Richard Dolan is with us

1345
01:06:59,809 --> 01:06:57,359
bombshell night three

1346
01:07:02,630 --> 01:06:59,819
should call this grant Cameron week

1347
01:07:05,930 --> 01:07:02,640
actually the Wilson Davis docks

1348
01:07:08,390 --> 01:07:05,940
and uh last night I did a deep dive on

1349
01:07:10,910 --> 01:07:08,400
the show Rich Dolan uh did a

1350
01:07:14,270 --> 01:07:10,920
presentation on this yesterday I had

1351
01:07:16,609 --> 01:07:14,280
Grant on Monday Grant has done

1352
01:07:19,490 --> 01:07:16,619
presentations uh throughout the week

1353
01:07:24,890 --> 01:07:19,500
this week live streaming too this is a

1354
01:07:26,750 --> 01:07:24,900
very big deal and uh uh Rich uh being I

1355
01:07:28,089 --> 01:07:26,760
just called you rich Richard being out

1356
01:07:32,809 --> 01:07:28,099
with us tonight

1357
01:07:36,049 --> 01:07:32,819
is important because uh of his role in

1358
01:07:39,230 --> 01:07:36,059
all of this and not only uh in the

1359
01:07:42,589 --> 01:07:39,240
documented itself but what it represents

1360
01:07:45,589 --> 01:07:42,599
and and so Richard uh where we left off

1361
01:07:48,289 --> 01:07:45,599
I want to get straight to it here

1362
01:07:50,270 --> 01:07:48,299
um uh four or five days ago yeah it's

1363
01:07:51,950 --> 01:07:50,280
one thing to have you know putting the

1364
01:07:54,109 --> 01:07:51,960
pieces of the puzzle together and

1365
01:07:55,670 --> 01:07:54,119
chasing down names and facts and dates

1366
01:07:58,250 --> 01:07:55,680
and we have the oak Shannon notes and

1367
01:08:00,049 --> 01:07:58,260
the checkout notes now too as well that

1368
01:08:03,049 --> 01:08:00,059
all help support this but it's another

1369
01:08:06,410 --> 01:08:03,059
thing to have somebody come for forward

1370
01:08:08,589 --> 01:08:06,420
from this document and Oak Shannon did

1371
01:08:12,950 --> 01:08:08,599
that he did that five days ago

1372
01:08:15,710 --> 01:08:12,960
and one of the things that Oak said in

1373
01:08:17,930 --> 01:08:15,720
that interview was that I talked to Eric

1374
01:08:20,030 --> 01:08:17,940
Davis Eric Davis and I go way back and

1375
01:08:23,630 --> 01:08:20,040
then I talked to him I talked to Admiral

1376
01:08:26,150 --> 01:08:23,640
Wilson about the two of them and these

1377
01:08:31,249 --> 01:08:26,160
conversations were going down and then

1378
01:08:34,689 --> 01:08:31,259
uh uh it it lined up perfectly with this

1379
01:08:37,910 --> 01:08:34,699
which is page one where Thomas Wilson

1380
01:08:40,729 --> 01:08:37,920
says I recall a phone call with Oak

1381
01:08:43,490 --> 01:08:40,739
Shannon uh followed by Big Oak Shannon

1382
01:08:45,530 --> 01:08:43,500
fan go back years in the Navy before Oak

1383
01:08:48,349 --> 01:08:45,540
left for Los Alamos National

1384
01:08:52,010 --> 01:08:48,359
Laboratories Oak talked for two hours

1385
01:08:55,370 --> 01:08:52,020
wanted to convince me uh about Eric

1386
01:08:57,769 --> 01:08:55,380
Davis about what he told Will Miller the

1387
01:09:01,150 --> 01:08:57,779
Boston Globe story with Leslie Kane yep

1388
01:09:05,749 --> 01:09:01,160
UFO topic crash UFOs bodies mj-12 Etc

1389
01:09:09,769 --> 01:09:05,759
well uh in Oak's statements uh from this

1390
01:09:12,950 --> 01:09:09,779
interview five days ago is exactly how

1391
01:09:17,450 --> 01:09:12,960
Thomas Wilson presented uh this to Eric

1392
01:09:20,329 --> 01:09:17,460
Davis in these notes and right and now

1393
01:09:23,390 --> 01:09:20,339
when you caught that was that an aha

1394
01:09:25,669 --> 01:09:23,400
moment for you where you can't go yes

1395
01:09:29,209 --> 01:09:25,679
so uh I'm sorry to jump in on you there

1396
01:09:32,150 --> 01:09:29,219
no no but I got excited

1397
01:09:34,189 --> 01:09:32,160
so um he was asked in that that was an

1398
01:09:36,289 --> 01:09:34,199
outstanding interview and uh Oak was

1399
01:09:38,990 --> 01:09:36,299
asked so were you contacted you'd get

1400
01:09:41,749 --> 01:09:39,000
into this in 2000 2001 and Oak Shannon

1401
01:09:43,550 --> 01:09:41,759
said no it was 1999.

1402
01:09:46,070 --> 01:09:43,560
so a couple of things there one it

1403
01:09:49,370 --> 01:09:46,080
Accords exactly with what Wilson said in

1404
01:09:50,749 --> 01:09:49,380
those notes uh Wilson said fall of 99.

1405
01:09:53,809 --> 01:09:50,759
the other thing that's interesting about

1406
01:09:56,090 --> 01:09:53,819
that in my opinion is you think about

1407
01:09:58,490 --> 01:09:56,100
how this whole thing happened all right

1408
01:10:00,530 --> 01:09:58,500
so it starts it's Stephen Greer

1409
01:10:04,010 --> 01:10:00,540
you got to start with Stephen Greer on

1410
01:10:06,650 --> 01:10:04,020
basically on his mission to go into DC

1411
01:10:08,990 --> 01:10:06,660
at this time and speak with high-level

1412
01:10:11,209 --> 01:10:09,000
people about there was an nro document

1413
01:10:13,310 --> 01:10:11,219
that was very very important and I think

1414
01:10:16,310 --> 01:10:13,320
more generally he was just talking about

1415
01:10:19,130 --> 01:10:16,320
um Rogue black budget

1416
01:10:20,990 --> 01:10:19,140
E.T reverse engineering programs he had

1417
01:10:22,430 --> 01:10:21,000
Edgar Mitchell with him he had will

1418
01:10:24,590 --> 01:10:22,440
Miller with him

1419
01:10:26,450 --> 01:10:24,600
and they get this meeting with Admiral

1420
01:10:28,790 --> 01:10:26,460
Thomas Wilson in April I think April 9

1421
01:10:31,850 --> 01:10:28,800
1997.

1422
01:10:33,830 --> 01:10:31,860
and uh Greer gives a presentation he

1423
01:10:35,570 --> 01:10:33,840
talks about Philip Corso whose book was

1424
01:10:39,890 --> 01:10:35,580
coming out at that time

1425
01:10:42,470 --> 01:10:39,900
that was very very significant event uh

1426
01:10:45,169 --> 01:10:42,480
you know many remember

1427
01:10:47,510 --> 01:10:45,179
and then that ended and um

1428
01:10:48,590 --> 01:10:47,520
Miller stays behind talks with Wilson we

1429
01:10:51,470 --> 01:10:48,600
have this in the notes they have a

1430
01:10:52,370 --> 01:10:51,480
two-hour conversation Wilson goes on his

1431
01:10:55,250 --> 01:10:52,380
uh

1432
01:10:57,649 --> 01:10:55,260
his quest for 45 days to get to the

1433
01:11:00,470 --> 01:10:57,659
bottom of this he gets rejected and then

1434
01:11:03,950 --> 01:11:00,480
what clearly happened

1435
01:11:07,370 --> 01:11:03,960
is that Wilson spoke to Miller

1436
01:11:09,709 --> 01:11:07,380
first this is the only scenario that

1437
01:11:11,270 --> 01:11:09,719
makes any sense Wilson spoke to will

1438
01:11:14,090 --> 01:11:11,280
Miller because they were close they were

1439
01:11:17,390 --> 01:11:14,100
Navy colleagues and Miller was the key

1440
01:11:18,950 --> 01:11:17,400
because Miller knew Greer and he gave

1441
01:11:21,290 --> 01:11:18,960
this information to Greer and this ended

1442
01:11:24,410 --> 01:11:21,300
up Greer of course uh talked about this

1443
01:11:26,810 --> 01:11:24,420
consistently after that fact in a number

1444
01:11:28,970 --> 01:11:26,820
of uh lectures and presentations and

1445
01:11:31,130 --> 01:11:28,980
then wrote about it in 2006 in his book

1446
01:11:32,990 --> 01:11:31,140
hidden truth Forbidden Knowledge so

1447
01:11:36,110 --> 01:11:33,000
that's the Miller Greer connection but

1448
01:11:37,130 --> 01:11:36,120
Miller also spoke to Edgar Mitchell

1449
01:11:39,410 --> 01:11:37,140
about this

1450
01:11:41,930 --> 01:11:39,420
after Wilson got rejected

1451
01:11:44,090 --> 01:11:41,940
so the information went into these two

1452
01:11:46,669 --> 01:11:44,100
different directions now Mitchell is

1453
01:11:48,530 --> 01:11:46,679
really important here I mean Greer is

1454
01:11:50,209 --> 01:11:48,540
important also but Mitchell Mitchell's

1455
01:11:52,490 --> 01:11:50,219
important because he was

1456
01:11:54,470 --> 01:11:52,500
so he was informed of of all of this by

1457
01:11:56,330 --> 01:11:54,480
Miller and

1458
01:11:59,090 --> 01:11:56,340
and Mitchell was part of what I call the

1459
01:12:00,290 --> 01:11:59,100
Bigelow group The Ned's group they were

1460
01:12:01,729 --> 01:12:00,300
all on the board of Ned so you've got

1461
01:12:03,950 --> 01:12:01,739
Robert Bigelow you've got kit green you

1462
01:12:07,070 --> 01:12:03,960
got to help putt off you've got Jacques

1463
01:12:09,050 --> 01:12:07,080
valet you've got uh uh I don't know if

1464
01:12:12,250 --> 01:12:09,060
Bob Wood was deeply but Bob Wood was

1465
01:12:15,950 --> 01:12:12,260
part of that group as well

1466
01:12:19,490 --> 01:12:15,960
and Eric David and Eric Davis obviously

1467
01:12:23,090 --> 01:12:19,500
yes so that group of people

1468
01:12:24,950 --> 01:12:23,100
learned about this from Mitchell

1469
01:12:27,770 --> 01:12:24,960
there can be no question about this and

1470
01:12:29,689 --> 01:12:27,780
so as early as 1999

1471
01:12:32,390 --> 01:12:29,699
they were trying to get a meeting with

1472
01:12:34,310 --> 01:12:32,400
Wilson and Wilson at that time was head

1473
01:12:36,229 --> 01:12:34,320
of the defense intelligence agency he

1474
01:12:37,729 --> 01:12:36,239
was actively still involved in the

1475
01:12:39,709 --> 01:12:37,739
government

1476
01:12:41,330 --> 01:12:39,719
um I mean with the Joint Chiefs he was

1477
01:12:43,070 --> 01:12:41,340
the number one intelligence officer in

1478
01:12:44,870 --> 01:12:43,080
the country and he had that post for

1479
01:12:46,790 --> 01:12:44,880
three years the end of Bill Clinton and

1480
01:12:48,770 --> 01:12:46,800
the beginning of uh did you have that

1481
01:12:50,870 --> 01:12:48,780
with George Bush he left it yeah O2 so

1482
01:12:53,229 --> 01:12:50,880
he had that with Clinton and Bush

1483
01:12:56,510 --> 01:12:53,239
uh so that group

1484
01:12:57,830 --> 01:12:56,520
that important fascinating group of

1485
01:13:00,770 --> 01:12:57,840
individuals

1486
01:13:03,169 --> 01:13:00,780
they were on this almost immediately

1487
01:13:06,350 --> 01:13:03,179
trying to get to Wilson to talk to him

1488
01:13:08,990 --> 01:13:06,360
to get his story directly

1489
01:13:11,090 --> 01:13:09,000
and um I just think that's a fascinating

1490
01:13:13,790 --> 01:13:11,100
part of this that I've really heard

1491
01:13:14,570 --> 01:13:13,800
really people commenting on but uh they

1492
01:13:17,510 --> 01:13:14,580
were

1493
01:13:19,510 --> 01:13:17,520
trying to cut through get through the

1494
01:13:21,590 --> 01:13:19,520
Labyrinth themselves

1495
01:13:24,830 --> 01:13:21,600
and to have

1496
01:13:28,070 --> 01:13:24,840
um again uh uh back to what I thought

1497
01:13:32,330 --> 01:13:28,080
was just an extraordinary point was that

1498
01:13:33,890 --> 01:13:32,340
uh Oak Shannon's statements on this were

1499
01:13:38,570 --> 01:13:33,900
nearly verbatim

1500
01:13:40,189 --> 01:13:38,580
right his his memory recall of 1999 and

1501
01:13:41,810 --> 01:13:40,199
and the health issues he talked about

1502
01:13:44,930 --> 01:13:41,820
his health issues which were referenced

1503
01:13:47,750 --> 01:13:44,940
in those notes yeah and heart issues and

1504
01:13:50,750 --> 01:13:47,760
you go and you look at the notes and and

1505
01:13:54,229 --> 01:13:50,760
you start to put this together and then

1506
01:13:59,330 --> 01:13:54,239
you have to back up to 1985 right with

1507
01:14:02,030 --> 01:13:59,340
uh the ATP and and BDM and and the notes

1508
01:14:04,370 --> 01:14:02,040
that were compiled there

1509
01:14:06,229 --> 01:14:04,380
um all coming by the way and supports us

1510
01:14:08,930 --> 01:14:06,239
knew about those meetings

1511
01:14:11,450 --> 01:14:08,940
yes he did well I think it's an

1512
01:14:14,330 --> 01:14:11,460
interesting tidbit there it's it's a

1513
01:14:17,330 --> 01:14:14,340
conversation uh going on in the backseat

1514
01:14:20,750 --> 01:14:17,340
of all the locations by the way right

1515
01:14:23,990 --> 01:14:20,760
behind EG and G with the Janet Airlines

1516
01:14:26,450 --> 01:14:24,000
you know flights going to Area 51 right

1517
01:14:28,070 --> 01:14:26,460
over the fence and this conversation is

1518
01:14:32,330 --> 01:14:28,080
going on in the back of that car and

1519
01:14:36,229 --> 01:14:32,340
they were there for meetings at EG and G

1520
01:14:39,590 --> 01:14:36,239
yep right yeah that's right so

1521
01:14:41,810 --> 01:14:39,600
um okay so you've got UFO written all

1522
01:14:44,570 --> 01:14:41,820
over this yeah it's written all over it

1523
01:14:46,850 --> 01:14:44,580
and again for people who who may not uh

1524
01:14:48,890 --> 01:14:46,860
get the significance of the uh of John

1525
01:14:51,290 --> 01:14:48,900
Alexander's Advanced theoretical physics

1526
01:14:53,630 --> 01:14:51,300
group this is a fascinating bit of

1527
01:14:56,149 --> 01:14:53,640
history and I wrote about it a little

1528
01:14:58,729 --> 01:14:56,159
bit in one of my books and I I did not

1529
01:15:01,790 --> 01:14:58,739
even remotely do justice to it but it

1530
01:15:03,169 --> 01:15:01,800
was a very interesting group of of men

1531
01:15:05,110 --> 01:15:03,179
brilliant men

1532
01:15:08,570 --> 01:15:05,120
who were

1533
01:15:10,070 --> 01:15:08,580
trying to as I heard I've heard John

1534
01:15:11,270 --> 01:15:10,080
Alexander speak about this I heard one

1535
01:15:14,390 --> 01:15:11,280
of the other members talk to me about

1536
01:15:16,850 --> 01:15:14,400
this the idea was to get their own

1537
01:15:21,410 --> 01:15:16,860
center of gravity within the Pentagon as

1538
01:15:23,630 --> 01:15:21,420
the go-to UFO research group because uh

1539
01:15:27,649 --> 01:15:23,640
the idea being that they would then be

1540
01:15:30,830 --> 01:15:27,659
let into wherever the real UFO working

1541
01:15:32,330 --> 01:15:30,840
group actually was that that I have been

1542
01:15:34,550 --> 01:15:32,340
told just now I've heard this from two

1543
01:15:37,910 --> 01:15:34,560
of those members that was the stated or

1544
01:15:39,709 --> 01:15:37,920
that was their real goal they wanted in

1545
01:15:43,010 --> 01:15:39,719
they want it in and so they they

1546
01:15:45,649 --> 01:15:43,020
believed we have enough knowledge uh

1547
01:15:47,510 --> 01:15:45,659
collectively we you know we this group

1548
01:15:49,490 --> 01:15:47,520
of ours and we're going to be able to do

1549
01:15:51,350 --> 01:15:49,500
it and you know John Alexander spoke

1550
01:15:53,030 --> 01:15:51,360
about this a number of times uh various

1551
01:15:54,649 --> 01:15:53,040
events and he said well we just never

1552
01:15:57,350 --> 01:15:54,659
found that group that we found no

1553
01:15:58,850 --> 01:15:57,360
evidence that there was such a group now

1554
01:16:00,350 --> 01:15:58,860
I will just tell you I spoke to another

1555
01:16:02,149 --> 01:16:00,360
member of that group and that he did not

1556
01:16:04,550 --> 01:16:02,159
want John Alexander to know his identity

1557
01:16:08,209 --> 01:16:04,560
but he just said to me personally it has

1558
01:16:10,669 --> 01:16:08,219
a lot of BS we they exist I know they

1559
01:16:14,090 --> 01:16:10,679
existed he wouldn't tell me uh exactly

1560
01:16:16,189 --> 01:16:14,100
how he knew that but uh he absolutely

1561
01:16:18,290 --> 01:16:16,199
believed that there is such a group uh

1562
01:16:20,209 --> 01:16:18,300
in the within the Pentagon that John

1563
01:16:21,950 --> 01:16:20,219
Alexander always said no we never found

1564
01:16:24,050 --> 01:16:21,960
any indication that such a group existed

1565
01:16:26,930 --> 01:16:24,060
but that was I think one of the key

1566
01:16:30,590 --> 01:16:26,940
motivators for the advanced theoretical

1567
01:16:34,790 --> 01:16:30,600
physics group now there's two two things

1568
01:16:39,709 --> 01:16:34,800
um that we have to assume

1569
01:16:43,030 --> 01:16:39,719
um out of these notes one that J.A is

1570
01:16:47,270 --> 01:16:43,040
John Alexander yes absolutely okay

1571
01:16:49,970 --> 01:16:47,280
and there are comments in here about J.A

1572
01:16:55,510 --> 01:16:49,980
is not to be trusted right and what what

1573
01:16:59,209 --> 01:16:57,950
I've had my own Encounters of John

1574
01:17:01,130 --> 01:16:59,219
Alexander it's been a long time we

1575
01:17:03,169 --> 01:17:01,140
haven't communicated in a long while

1576
01:17:05,510 --> 01:17:03,179
we had we had an internet debate once

1577
01:17:08,270 --> 01:17:05,520
years ago is there a UFO cover-up I said

1578
01:17:10,910 --> 01:17:08,280
yes he said no I I know that I won that

1579
01:17:12,530 --> 01:17:10,920
but uh hey whatever

1580
01:17:14,510 --> 01:17:12,540
um

1581
01:17:16,370 --> 01:17:14,520
you know the thing about him I've just

1582
01:17:18,169 --> 01:17:16,380
uh

1583
01:17:20,090 --> 01:17:18,179
never really

1584
01:17:23,330 --> 01:17:20,100
it's hard to understand his public

1585
01:17:25,430 --> 01:17:23,340
positions on the lack of a UFO cover-up

1586
01:17:27,830 --> 01:17:25,440
he has said this for years and years and

1587
01:17:30,830 --> 01:17:27,840
I listened to this and I just think how

1588
01:17:33,410 --> 01:17:30,840
can you possibly make such a statement

1589
01:17:37,010 --> 01:17:33,420
like that so there's something that's

1590
01:17:38,390 --> 01:17:37,020
that's that's so deeply wrong about that

1591
01:17:41,270 --> 01:17:38,400
position

1592
01:17:43,669 --> 01:17:41,280
and so you have to conclude like what is

1593
01:17:45,830 --> 01:17:43,679
it are you a blockhead are you just not

1594
01:17:48,770 --> 01:17:45,840
are you just not honest

1595
01:17:50,510 --> 01:17:48,780
and I don't think he's a blockhead so

1596
01:17:52,669 --> 01:17:50,520
what can I say and I'm not I'm not

1597
01:17:55,070 --> 01:17:52,679
accusing like I don't know I don't know

1598
01:17:56,450 --> 01:17:55,080
why he maintains the position he has

1599
01:17:58,189 --> 01:17:56,460
maintained

1600
01:18:00,590 --> 01:17:58,199
but that's the fact and I've just never

1601
01:18:04,550 --> 01:18:00,600
really and I've I've asked people around

1602
01:18:06,189 --> 01:18:04,560
him like what is it why does he maintain

1603
01:18:07,850 --> 01:18:06,199
this

1604
01:18:15,229 --> 01:18:07,860
ridiculous

1605
01:18:18,669 --> 01:18:15,239
cover-up is so I I only met him once

1606
01:18:21,830 --> 01:18:18,679
and it was in Roswell okay

1607
01:18:23,870 --> 01:18:21,840
and uh we were having this breakfast

1608
01:18:26,270 --> 01:18:23,880
with like the mayor of Roswell or

1609
01:18:28,490 --> 01:18:26,280
something and uh I just done an

1610
01:18:32,930 --> 01:18:28,500
interview with the local FM radio

1611
01:18:35,630 --> 01:18:32,940
station upstairs that was uh anyway so

1612
01:18:37,790 --> 01:18:35,640
here's here's Alexander and he knows who

1613
01:18:39,290 --> 01:18:37,800
I am you know and coast to coast and

1614
01:18:40,850 --> 01:18:39,300
Fade to Black and all that stuff and I

1615
01:18:44,510 --> 01:18:40,860
said hey John

1616
01:18:46,910 --> 01:18:44,520
I would love to have you on on the show

1617
01:18:50,810 --> 01:18:46,920
what would we talk about

1618
01:18:53,810 --> 01:18:51,790
uh

1619
01:18:57,050 --> 01:18:53,820
what do you think I know stuff about

1620
01:18:59,330 --> 01:18:57,060
UFOs I said John let's just talk about

1621
01:19:04,790 --> 01:18:59,340
your career let's talk about your life

1622
01:19:09,530 --> 01:19:07,850
she's moving Alex John Alexander no I

1623
01:19:12,770 --> 01:19:09,540
was like okay all right that this

1624
01:19:14,689 --> 01:19:12,780
conversation has uh been resolved and uh

1625
01:19:17,810 --> 01:19:14,699
and I just let it go I just let it go

1626
01:19:19,970 --> 01:19:17,820
you didn't get him on yeah no no no it

1627
01:19:23,030 --> 01:19:19,980
was weird too I mean I just thought that

1628
01:19:26,090 --> 01:19:23,040
I mean he just went right there you know

1629
01:19:30,250 --> 01:19:26,100
what what what I don't know anything

1630
01:19:32,570 --> 01:19:30,260
about UFOs you're at Roswell man

1631
01:19:34,430 --> 01:19:32,580
what do you mean you're standing

1632
01:19:36,530 --> 01:19:34,440
underneath a flying saucer right now

1633
01:19:37,729 --> 01:19:36,540
here though by the way John Alexander is

1634
01:19:38,510 --> 01:19:37,739
another of the guys who was you know

1635
01:19:40,310 --> 01:19:38,520
very

1636
01:19:41,450 --> 01:19:40,320
closely associated with that Bigelow

1637
01:19:45,169 --> 01:19:41,460
group I should have mentioned his name

1638
01:19:47,110 --> 01:19:45,179
so he clearly would have been exposed to

1639
01:19:51,350 --> 01:19:47,120
those notes right away

1640
01:19:54,410 --> 01:19:51,360
and and would have known I you have to

1641
01:19:55,970 --> 01:19:54,420
assume would have known the the um the

1642
01:19:58,189 --> 01:19:55,980
story

1643
01:20:01,310 --> 01:19:58,199
uh after Mitchell had gotten it

1644
01:20:06,169 --> 01:20:01,320
now and the other thing that is uh

1645
01:20:09,110 --> 01:20:06,179
clandestine uh in these notes is who is

1646
01:20:12,590 --> 01:20:09,120
the Aerospace corporation that is

1647
01:20:16,250 --> 01:20:12,600
referred to here as top tippity top and

1648
01:20:17,930 --> 01:20:16,260
I have always interjected uh Lockheed

1649
01:20:19,490 --> 01:20:17,940
Skunk Works

1650
01:20:22,310 --> 01:20:19,500
um and that's that's an assumption

1651
01:20:25,490 --> 01:20:22,320
because it's not named and and Thomas

1652
01:20:27,970 --> 01:20:25,500
Wilson is very clear in this that he's

1653
01:20:30,189 --> 01:20:27,980
not going to mention that

1654
01:20:33,470 --> 01:20:30,199
yeah

1655
01:20:35,450 --> 01:20:33,480
must not ever be divulged

1656
01:20:37,729 --> 01:20:35,460
so do you think it's Lockheed Skunk

1657
01:20:40,729 --> 01:20:37,739
Works I think it's probably a really

1658
01:20:42,229 --> 01:20:40,739
good bet yeah I think I I get the idea

1659
01:20:44,149 --> 01:20:42,239
the most betting money would probably

1660
01:20:47,030 --> 01:20:44,159
put it at Lockheed it doesn't have to be

1661
01:20:49,250 --> 01:20:47,040
there's other competent contractors out

1662
01:20:50,750 --> 01:20:49,260
there and I think there's a very strong

1663
01:20:53,510 --> 01:20:50,760
likelihood that you've got multiple

1664
01:20:55,250 --> 01:20:53,520
contractors maybe compartmented doing

1665
01:20:56,090 --> 01:20:55,260
different aspects of research on this

1666
01:21:01,370 --> 01:20:56,100
problem

1667
01:21:02,570 --> 01:21:01,380
but uh sure you'd have to give some of

1668
01:21:03,850 --> 01:21:02,580
it to Lockheed I mean look they've got

1669
01:21:06,590 --> 01:21:03,860
some of the best

1670
01:21:10,970 --> 01:21:06,600
engineering and scientific Minds you can

1671
01:21:12,709 --> 01:21:10,980
find anywhere okay now uh we there's a

1672
01:21:15,470 --> 01:21:12,719
couple of other things I want to get uh

1673
01:21:16,550 --> 01:21:15,480
deeper into the document I mean I'm

1674
01:21:17,990 --> 01:21:16,560
sorry to interrupt you but like over

1675
01:21:20,149 --> 01:21:18,000
years there's was Battelle Memorial

1676
01:21:23,030 --> 01:21:20,159
Institute out in Ohio

1677
01:21:26,090 --> 01:21:23,040
they clearly years and years and years

1678
01:21:27,709 --> 01:21:26,100
and years ago got uh I'm convinced they

1679
01:21:29,149 --> 01:21:27,719
got Roswell material

1680
01:21:31,010 --> 01:21:29,159
out of which they developed the

1681
01:21:33,709 --> 01:21:31,020
substance nitinol you know the memory

1682
01:21:36,110 --> 01:21:33,719
metal uh there's a very good paper trail

1683
01:21:39,649 --> 01:21:36,120
on that or at least a good testimony

1684
01:21:41,270 --> 01:21:39,659
Trail let's put it that way and um so

1685
01:21:44,149 --> 01:21:41,280
yeah Lockheed wouldn't be the only

1686
01:21:46,430 --> 01:21:44,159
company that gets this material no you

1687
01:21:49,130 --> 01:21:46,440
have General Electric you have Boeing

1688
01:21:52,910 --> 01:21:49,140
you have Northrop Grumman you have

1689
01:21:55,250 --> 01:21:52,920
Raytheon you know there's a very that

1690
01:21:57,229 --> 01:21:55,260
are all in sap programs every single one

1691
01:21:59,090 --> 01:21:57,239
of them there's that that's what they do

1692
01:22:01,970 --> 01:21:59,100
exactly so I mean it doesn't have to be

1693
01:22:04,370 --> 01:22:01,980
Lockheed but hey you know uh Harry Reid

1694
01:22:07,130 --> 01:22:04,380
mentioned it is Lockheed in in the New

1695
01:22:10,510 --> 01:22:07,140
Yorker article uh that he immediately

1696
01:22:13,550 --> 01:22:10,520
retracted in a Twitter tweet uh

1697
01:22:16,189 --> 01:22:13,560
yeah that's right away from that one he

1698
01:22:19,310 --> 01:22:16,199
pulled up Buzz Aldrin who are rich and

1699
01:22:21,290 --> 01:22:19,320
Doug too quickly who are rich and Doug

1700
01:22:23,390 --> 01:22:21,300
Rich and Doug are mentioned throughout

1701
01:22:24,770 --> 01:22:23,400
this document yeah yeah I don't I I if I

1702
01:22:26,750 --> 01:22:24,780
knew I don't know I'm not sure I know

1703
01:22:30,530 --> 01:22:26,760
who they are

1704
01:22:32,450 --> 01:22:30,540
um clearly uh uh Eric Davis and Thomas

1705
01:22:35,990 --> 01:22:32,460
Wilson knew who rich and Doug were

1706
01:22:38,330 --> 01:22:36,000
because they refer back and forth uh uh

1707
01:22:40,550 --> 01:22:38,340
with first names only

1708
01:22:42,110 --> 01:22:40,560
and you know clearly the people Davis is

1709
01:22:43,390 --> 01:22:42,120
writing this for which is the whole

1710
01:22:46,850 --> 01:22:43,400
Bigelow group

1711
01:22:49,310 --> 01:22:46,860
Edgar Mitchell and fill in the blanks

1712
01:22:51,770 --> 01:22:49,320
all the others uh they obviously all

1713
01:22:52,630 --> 01:22:51,780
have to know

1714
01:22:57,830 --> 01:22:52,640
um

1715
01:23:01,189 --> 01:22:57,840
the uh there was uh I'm going to get to

1716
01:23:04,910 --> 01:23:01,199
this here in a second uh two women

1717
01:23:08,930 --> 01:23:04,920
um are named here one is a a a deputy

1718
01:23:12,470 --> 01:23:08,940
director and then on the last page uh

1719
01:23:15,410 --> 01:23:12,480
Elizabeth Elliott yes and now I want to

1720
01:23:18,169 --> 01:23:15,420
let's go to uh Mary Elizabeth

1721
01:23:19,250 --> 01:23:18,179
um very interesting name to have have

1722
01:23:23,450 --> 01:23:19,260
there

1723
01:23:26,330 --> 01:23:23,460
um and and obviously you you've done a

1724
01:23:27,350 --> 01:23:26,340
lot of uh investigation into this who is

1725
01:23:33,709 --> 01:23:27,360
she

1726
01:23:37,189 --> 01:23:33,719
Aerospace out on out in California

1727
01:23:38,450 --> 01:23:37,199
trying to recall uh gosh I wish I had

1728
01:23:41,030 --> 01:23:38,460
I should have prepared on this one

1729
01:23:43,130 --> 01:23:41,040
beforehand so I'm winging it but

1730
01:23:45,290 --> 01:23:43,140
she's very interesting

1731
01:23:46,430 --> 01:23:45,300
I think she's very very very interesting

1732
01:23:49,550 --> 01:23:46,440
because she's mentioned in connection

1733
01:23:51,470 --> 01:23:49,560
with someone named Jeffrey Griffith

1734
01:23:53,750 --> 01:23:51,480
and they are they're clearly friends

1735
01:23:55,430 --> 01:23:53,760
they're close in some way

1736
01:23:57,470 --> 01:23:55,440
now

1737
01:24:01,370 --> 01:23:57,480
Jeffrey Griffith

1738
01:24:04,490 --> 01:24:01,380
I am one thousand percent convinced

1739
01:24:07,550 --> 01:24:04,500
is the author of um

1740
01:24:11,209 --> 01:24:07,560
of an article that was in UFO magazine a

1741
01:24:13,370 --> 01:24:11,219
three-part article in 1998

1742
01:24:15,830 --> 01:24:13,380
this is all relevant here

1743
01:24:19,130 --> 01:24:15,840
uh the article he wrote was was titled

1744
01:24:21,890 --> 01:24:19,140
uh sedge Masters it was a three-part

1745
01:24:24,530 --> 01:24:21,900
I found this I pdf'd it it's on my

1746
01:24:26,689 --> 01:24:24,540
website and anyone can find it it's uh

1747
01:24:29,750 --> 01:24:26,699
that's that's open stuff

1748
01:24:32,630 --> 01:24:29,760
so this is this is fictionalized history

1749
01:24:35,149 --> 01:24:32,640
what he was writing but basically what I

1750
01:24:37,189 --> 01:24:35,159
am quite convinced of is that he and

1751
01:24:39,350 --> 01:24:37,199
somehow Mary Elizabeth Elliott was

1752
01:24:43,370 --> 01:24:39,360
involved they they very well may have

1753
01:24:46,070 --> 01:24:43,380
been UFO Witnesses over by Palos Verde

1754
01:24:48,830 --> 01:24:46,080
right across from Catalina Island and uh

1755
01:24:50,570 --> 01:24:48,840
Santa Rosa Island and where uh the

1756
01:24:53,930 --> 01:24:50,580
Channel Islands were so much Uso

1757
01:24:54,950 --> 01:24:53,940
activity has been recorded for a long

1758
01:24:56,649 --> 01:24:54,960
time

1759
01:24:59,630 --> 01:24:56,659
and they

1760
01:25:01,490 --> 01:24:59,640
were Uso Witnesses they were driving

1761
01:25:04,430 --> 01:25:01,500
along the highway

1762
01:25:06,110 --> 01:25:04,440
and an object I mean this is what I

1763
01:25:08,689 --> 01:25:06,120
believe this is how he has written about

1764
01:25:10,910 --> 01:25:08,699
it the object came out of the water and

1765
01:25:12,830 --> 01:25:10,920
flew right over their head and they

1766
01:25:14,209 --> 01:25:12,840
went up after it now she may not have

1767
01:25:16,370 --> 01:25:14,219
been in the car

1768
01:25:17,930 --> 01:25:16,380
but uh she may have been and she was

1769
01:25:20,209 --> 01:25:17,940
definitely a friend and she knew all

1770
01:25:23,870 --> 01:25:20,219
about it so and and I think she worked

1771
01:25:25,669 --> 01:25:23,880
at TRW Griffith is an attorney I don't

1772
01:25:27,050 --> 01:25:25,679
believe she's alive anymore I think she

1773
01:25:29,090 --> 01:25:27,060
passed away a couple of years ago

1774
01:25:30,770 --> 01:25:29,100
because I was I was talking with a

1775
01:25:33,290 --> 01:25:30,780
colleague and a researcher friend of

1776
01:25:35,450 --> 01:25:33,300
mine and we were trying to reach her

1777
01:25:37,910 --> 01:25:35,460
and her health was failing at the time

1778
01:25:40,669 --> 01:25:37,920
and I I think she did not survive

1779
01:25:41,689 --> 01:25:40,679
but um and Jeffrey Griffis will not talk

1780
01:25:44,870 --> 01:25:41,699
to anybody

1781
01:25:47,990 --> 01:25:44,880
yeah now uh and and back to anyway yeah

1782
01:25:50,689 --> 01:25:48,000
so there uh their story is mentioned and

1783
01:25:52,430 --> 01:25:50,699
in the notes uh it's it's like yeah we

1784
01:25:55,370 --> 01:25:52,440
she's the real deal

1785
01:26:00,290 --> 01:25:55,380
and they they refer to it as the TRW

1786
01:26:03,110 --> 01:26:00,300
incident and uh I I think I would have

1787
01:26:06,169 --> 01:26:03,120
to go back and check wasn't the TRW

1788
01:26:09,470 --> 01:26:06,179
incident listed in Oak Shannon's notes

1789
01:26:12,910 --> 01:26:09,480
oh golly was it yeah that's the score

1790
01:26:17,330 --> 01:26:12,920
yeah yeah yeah so do you see TRW

1791
01:26:20,510 --> 01:26:17,340
yeah I think if that's true I I only

1792
01:26:22,669 --> 01:26:20,520
learned about this today these yes

1793
01:26:24,169 --> 01:26:22,679
okay so I I mean I just have to plead

1794
01:26:27,290 --> 01:26:24,179
ignorance here so I haven't studied all

1795
01:26:30,770 --> 01:26:27,300
of them okay on the BDM connection of

1796
01:26:33,169 --> 01:26:30,780
course and the the ap10 connection those

1797
01:26:34,189 --> 01:26:33,179
are significant you have Tia well

1798
01:26:36,050 --> 01:26:34,199
there's a couple of other things in

1799
01:26:38,270 --> 01:26:36,060
there I know I just glanced at them I

1800
01:26:40,189 --> 01:26:38,280
didn't study them

1801
01:26:41,750 --> 01:26:40,199
but uh

1802
01:26:45,410 --> 01:26:41,760
anyway I'll have to go back over if

1803
01:26:48,110 --> 01:26:45,420
that's in there then yeah and then uh

1804
01:26:50,510 --> 01:26:48,120
Judith Daly I don't think it would have

1805
01:26:53,870 --> 01:26:50,520
been if well actually

1806
01:26:56,030 --> 01:26:53,880
if the TRW thing is in there that's

1807
01:26:57,950 --> 01:26:56,040
actually quite important Jimmy yeah

1808
01:27:00,229 --> 01:26:57,960
because I have been trying to get a date

1809
01:27:02,870 --> 01:27:00,239
on this event

1810
01:27:06,110 --> 01:27:02,880
and it's it has not been clear to me

1811
01:27:08,450 --> 01:27:06,120
even what decade that sighting occurred

1812
01:27:10,250 --> 01:27:08,460
so if it's in those notes now we're

1813
01:27:12,169 --> 01:27:10,260
talking mid-1980s and that I think

1814
01:27:14,030 --> 01:27:12,179
that's really good that would nail it

1815
01:27:15,830 --> 01:27:14,040
down a little bit better because I I've

1816
01:27:18,709 --> 01:27:15,840
never been sure it was that a 1990s

1817
01:27:21,470 --> 01:27:18,719
incident or was it as early as the 1970s

1818
01:27:22,669 --> 01:27:21,480
or 1980s so if it's in those notes that

1819
01:27:25,370 --> 01:27:22,679
would at least

1820
01:27:27,709 --> 01:27:25,380
give you um give us a

1821
01:27:30,950 --> 01:27:27,719
you know a latest

1822
01:27:33,890 --> 01:27:30,960
you know like it had to be before 1980s

1823
01:27:37,250 --> 01:27:33,900
and before we get to the Break

1824
01:27:39,290 --> 01:27:37,260
um here uh Thomas Wilson says you need

1825
01:27:41,450 --> 01:27:39,300
to you need to talk to Judy Daley she

1826
01:27:44,090 --> 01:27:41,460
could assist you on that and Judith Daly

1827
01:27:46,490 --> 01:27:44,100
at the time was assistant Deputy under

1828
01:27:51,830 --> 01:27:46,500
secretary for defense for advanced

1829
01:27:55,490 --> 01:27:51,840
development over at usat and uh on the

1830
01:27:59,390 --> 01:27:55,500
next page of uh the Wilson Davis

1831
01:28:01,629 --> 01:27:59,400
document is is this little nugget and

1832
01:28:04,790 --> 01:28:01,639
and I think that this is significant

1833
01:28:07,490 --> 01:28:04,800
which Thomas Wilson says she said he's

1834
01:28:09,470 --> 01:28:07,500
talking about Judith Daly said by phone

1835
01:28:11,750 --> 01:28:09,480
call that security and other programs

1836
01:28:14,930 --> 01:28:11,760
budget records were being revamped and

1837
01:28:16,729 --> 01:28:14,940
relocated uh by their own records Group

1838
01:28:19,490 --> 01:28:16,739
Security budgets

1839
01:28:23,450 --> 01:28:19,500
um but she points out to him that these

1840
01:28:27,470 --> 01:28:23,460
budgets could be uh misunderstood

1841
01:28:29,990 --> 01:28:27,480
because the money is is unknown it goes

1842
01:28:31,970 --> 01:28:30,000
out out whatever they do with it and

1843
01:28:34,129 --> 01:28:31,980
then when we go back and try to audit

1844
01:28:36,110 --> 01:28:34,139
these sometimes we get three four five

1845
01:28:38,689 --> 01:28:36,120
years compressed into one year and we

1846
01:28:41,390 --> 01:28:38,699
get one month one month figure coming

1847
01:28:43,910 --> 01:28:41,400
back and it's not going to confirm

1848
01:28:47,810 --> 01:28:43,920
anything but we have another name here

1849
01:28:49,910 --> 01:28:47,820
right and it's Judith Daly yeah

1850
01:28:52,129 --> 01:28:49,920
well I've done no follow-up on her I

1851
01:28:54,229 --> 01:28:52,139
mean I have to just say that so um if

1852
01:28:56,030 --> 01:28:54,239
other researchers have she would be

1853
01:28:58,669 --> 01:28:56,040
important too

1854
01:28:59,770 --> 01:28:58,679
see what we can learn about her

1855
01:29:03,470 --> 01:28:59,780
um

1856
01:29:05,570 --> 01:29:03,480
one one thing that's that is uh

1857
01:29:08,330 --> 01:29:05,580
I mean somewhat Loosely connected to

1858
01:29:10,729 --> 01:29:08,340
what you're saying here is the fact that

1859
01:29:13,970 --> 01:29:10,739
you know we learn in these notes that

1860
01:29:16,189 --> 01:29:13,980
the the Contracting group that was

1861
01:29:17,810 --> 01:29:16,199
trying attempting to reverse engineer

1862
01:29:20,390 --> 01:29:17,820
this alien Tech and actually had an

1863
01:29:23,629 --> 01:29:20,400
intact saucer according to the notes

1864
01:29:26,270 --> 01:29:23,639
that they had almost been outed exposed

1865
01:29:28,189 --> 01:29:26,280
during a pentagon audit uh some years

1866
01:29:31,070 --> 01:29:28,199
back

1867
01:29:34,189 --> 01:29:31,080
and that as a result of that near

1868
01:29:38,450 --> 01:29:34,199
exposure they had to bring that auditor

1869
01:29:41,689 --> 01:29:38,460
into the uh into the clearance it'd be

1870
01:29:44,810 --> 01:29:41,699
clear to know about it and it was a a

1871
01:29:47,629 --> 01:29:44,820
real a close call I guess and so as a

1872
01:29:48,830 --> 01:29:47,639
result of that they took additional

1873
01:29:51,229 --> 01:29:48,840
measures

1874
01:29:53,330 --> 01:29:51,239
to make their program even more secret

1875
01:29:56,390 --> 01:29:53,340
now one thing that we do know is that

1876
01:29:59,510 --> 01:29:56,400
when uh the Clinton team came into power

1877
01:30:02,810 --> 01:29:59,520
in 1993 uh William Perry was the

1878
01:30:05,649 --> 01:30:02,820
Secretary of Defense and he oversaw

1879
01:30:08,870 --> 01:30:05,659
a fairly significant overhaul or

1880
01:30:12,110 --> 01:30:08,880
reorganization of how the pentagon's

1881
01:30:13,910 --> 01:30:12,120
records were kept I I do not know the

1882
01:30:16,850 --> 01:30:13,920
details of how what was changed and so

1883
01:30:21,290 --> 01:30:16,860
on but that did happen and that that's a

1884
01:30:24,410 --> 01:30:21,300
that's a historical fact and you know I

1885
01:30:27,050 --> 01:30:24,420
really have to wonder like did this

1886
01:30:29,689 --> 01:30:27,060
outing of this group or the near outing

1887
01:30:31,689 --> 01:30:29,699
prompt this reorg

1888
01:30:34,610 --> 01:30:31,699
well okay

1889
01:30:37,790 --> 01:30:34,620
yeah I I think that's a great point and

1890
01:30:39,830 --> 01:30:37,800
I'll tell you what why that is not only

1891
01:30:43,250 --> 01:30:39,840
a great point but what is also very

1892
01:30:46,729 --> 01:30:43,260
intriguing uh when uh Thomas Wilson

1893
01:30:48,950 --> 01:30:46,739
comes into the fold because they tell he

1894
01:30:51,350 --> 01:30:48,960
calls them the three right the program

1895
01:30:54,229 --> 01:30:51,360
director the attorney and and somebody

1896
01:30:56,090 --> 01:30:54,239
else the three that um this happens

1897
01:30:58,430 --> 01:30:56,100
learning the security the security

1898
01:31:00,470 --> 01:30:58,440
manager yeah security uh head of

1899
01:31:02,689 --> 01:31:00,480
security and the program manager and

1900
01:31:05,209 --> 01:31:02,699
they tell them this happened before so

1901
01:31:07,129 --> 01:31:05,219
we had to bring in somebody we showed

1902
01:31:09,950 --> 01:31:07,139
them what we were working on which was

1903
01:31:12,410 --> 01:31:09,960
UFOs and once he found out the alien

1904
01:31:14,270 --> 01:31:12,420
connection he understood that this

1905
01:31:15,830 --> 01:31:14,280
investigation was going to stop and

1906
01:31:18,649 --> 01:31:15,840
because of that we're going to tell you

1907
01:31:21,110 --> 01:31:18,659
right now Thomas Wilson we don't give a

1908
01:31:23,810 --> 01:31:21,120
crap about you we don't give a crap

1909
01:31:28,729 --> 01:31:23,820
about who you are defense intelligence

1910
01:31:29,570 --> 01:31:28,739
agency J2 guy go and cry go back to

1911
01:31:32,090 --> 01:31:29,580
Washington

1912
01:31:34,430 --> 01:31:32,100
it doesn't matter do whatever you want

1913
01:31:35,810 --> 01:31:34,440
to do we've been through this before we

1914
01:31:37,610 --> 01:31:35,820
scared the crap out of the last

1915
01:31:40,010 --> 01:31:37,620
investigator and we're going to do that

1916
01:31:41,689 --> 01:31:40,020
with you today conversation over and

1917
01:31:44,030 --> 01:31:41,699
that's basically what happened in a

1918
01:31:46,070 --> 01:31:44,040
nutshell that's it exactly and Wilson

1919
01:31:47,450 --> 01:31:46,080
There was an argument put out by one of

1920
01:31:50,209 --> 01:31:47,460
the Skeptics on these documents that

1921
01:31:52,070 --> 01:31:50,219
Wilson as J2 head of intelligence should

1922
01:31:54,410 --> 01:31:52,080
have known that this would not be within

1923
01:31:56,090 --> 01:31:54,420
his purview within uh to investigate

1924
01:31:58,970 --> 01:31:56,100
these programs within the special access

1925
01:32:02,330 --> 01:31:58,980
program oversight committee sapoc

1926
01:32:03,350 --> 01:32:02,340
well maybe that's no now but I don't

1927
01:32:05,570 --> 01:32:03,360
think that would have been very well

1928
01:32:08,510 --> 01:32:05,580
known in 1997. the reorgan just happened

1929
01:32:11,209 --> 01:32:08,520
Wilson Wilson wasn't like you can't

1930
01:32:13,129 --> 01:32:11,219
assume he was some expert in all of the

1931
01:32:14,810 --> 01:32:13,139
bureaucratic uh restrictions and

1932
01:32:17,689 --> 01:32:14,820
shenanigans that were going on in a

1933
01:32:20,510 --> 01:32:17,699
recently reorged pentagon uh how could

1934
01:32:22,430 --> 01:32:20,520
he he's gone omniscient so he had an

1935
01:32:25,010 --> 01:32:22,440
assumption turned out to be wrong that

1936
01:32:27,530 --> 01:32:25,020
he had the right to oversee this program

1937
01:32:29,750 --> 01:32:27,540
and he was fired up and that's what he

1938
01:32:31,970 --> 01:32:29,760
told them and and as you point out they

1939
01:32:34,129 --> 01:32:31,980
said no uh we don't really give a crap

1940
01:32:36,350 --> 01:32:34,139
about you uh you want to go crime home

1941
01:32:39,110 --> 01:32:36,360
to Mama go ahead see how far it gets you

1942
01:32:40,669 --> 01:32:39,120
and he did complain to his superiors in

1943
01:32:43,370 --> 01:32:40,679
DC and they told they threatened him

1944
01:32:46,370 --> 01:32:43,380
with his career yeah they literally said

1945
01:32:49,070 --> 01:32:46,380
they literally said this ends now yeah

1946
01:32:50,810 --> 01:32:49,080
it sounds now conversation's over uh

1947
01:32:52,490 --> 01:32:50,820
let's take our break right here this is

1948
01:32:54,290 --> 01:32:52,500
Fade to Black I am your host human

1949
01:32:57,950 --> 01:32:54,300
chairs tonight Richard Dolan it's

1950
01:32:59,390 --> 01:32:57,960
bombshell week night three here on Fade

1951
01:33:00,709 --> 01:32:59,400
to Black I'm your Chevy Church we're

1952
01:33:03,410 --> 01:33:00,719
going to continue with the Wilson Davis

1953
01:33:05,149 --> 01:33:03,420
docs and the Bombshells from this week

1954
01:33:12,170 --> 01:33:05,159
right after this short break stay with

1955
01:33:20,210 --> 01:33:17,169
[Music]

1956
01:33:22,810 --> 01:33:20,220
thank you

1957
01:33:25,990 --> 01:33:22,820
[Music]

1958
01:33:28,620 --> 01:33:26,000
way out here we listen to Jimmy Church

1959
01:33:31,310 --> 01:33:28,630
you're listening to Fade to Black

1960
01:33:33,649 --> 01:33:31,320
[Applause]

1961
01:33:38,510 --> 01:33:33,659
you're listening to jebby church and

1962
01:33:49,600 --> 01:33:40,070
advocacy

1963
01:33:53,990 --> 01:33:51,890
[Music]

1964
01:33:56,330 --> 01:33:54,000
the believer is the chilling true story

1965
01:33:58,610 --> 01:33:56,340
of Dr John Mack a renowned Harvard

1966
01:34:01,370 --> 01:33:58,620
psychiatrist and Pulitzer Prize winner

1967
01:34:04,070 --> 01:34:01,380
this is a outreach program from the

1968
01:34:06,290 --> 01:34:04,080
cosmos to the consciously impaired you

1969
01:34:08,890 --> 01:34:06,300
risked it all to investigate human

1970
01:34:12,169 --> 01:34:08,900
encounters with aliens the believer

1971
01:34:14,330 --> 01:34:12,179
alien encounters hard science and the

1972
01:34:16,070 --> 01:34:14,340
passion of John Mack written by

1973
01:34:18,350 --> 01:34:16,080
award-winning former New York Times

1974
01:34:20,570 --> 01:34:18,360
journalist and author Ralph Blumenthal

1975
01:34:21,910 --> 01:34:20,580
now available in paperback from high

1976
01:34:24,470 --> 01:34:21,920
road books

1977
01:34:26,510 --> 01:34:24,480
introducing the game changer blend from

1978
01:34:28,910 --> 01:34:26,520
River Moon coffee that delivers a

1979
01:34:31,610 --> 01:34:28,920
customized blend made specifically for

1980
01:34:34,970 --> 01:34:31,620
the fader knots if the game is rigged

1981
01:34:37,729 --> 01:34:34,980
change the game it's a bolder cup with

1982
01:34:39,950 --> 01:34:37,739
some bite Game Changer is the coffee of

1983
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choice for those that prefer an organic

1984
01:34:45,770 --> 01:34:42,300
dark roast that is slightly lighter and

1985
01:34:48,229 --> 01:34:45,780
milder but it's still dark with wild

1986
01:34:50,810 --> 01:34:48,239
notes of pecans and chocolate with a

1987
01:34:52,970 --> 01:34:50,820
rich balanced full-bodied cup that is

1988
01:34:55,610 --> 01:34:52,980
roasted to Perfection for a great coffee

1989
01:34:59,090 --> 01:34:55,620
to start your day as an after dinner

1990
01:35:01,910 --> 01:34:59,100
coffee or anywhere in between Artisan

1991
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1992
01:35:06,950 --> 01:35:04,260
certified organic all River Moon coffee

1993
01:35:09,709 --> 01:35:06,960
is freshly roasted and packaged in the

1994
01:35:11,689 --> 01:35:09,719
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1995
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click on the banners over on our site

1996
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and use the promo code f2b blend for 15

1997
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1998
01:35:24,290 --> 01:35:21,480
rivermooncoffee.com do you want to be an

1999
01:35:26,330 --> 01:35:24,300
official fate or not of course you do

2000
01:35:29,410 --> 01:35:26,340
this is Jimmy Church of Fade to Black

2001
01:35:32,629 --> 01:35:29,420
just go to our membership section at

2002
01:35:34,010 --> 01:35:32,639
jimmychurchradio.com baiter knots when

2003
01:35:35,870 --> 01:35:34,020
you think about the future of our

2004
01:35:38,570 --> 01:35:35,880
country and where we're headed do you

2005
01:35:40,669 --> 01:35:38,580
wonder about the food supply I do

2006
01:35:42,950 --> 01:35:40,679
disruptions in the food supply chain

2007
01:35:45,950 --> 01:35:42,960
could be disastrous and they usually

2008
01:35:47,990 --> 01:35:45,960
occur with little warning that's why the

2009
01:35:51,229 --> 01:35:48,000
smartest thing you can do today is to

2010
01:35:54,169 --> 01:35:51,239
stockpile emergency food water and other

2011
01:35:56,330 --> 01:35:54,179
Essentials I personally recommend my

2012
01:35:58,370 --> 01:35:56,340
Patriot Supply they're the nation's

2013
01:36:01,189 --> 01:35:58,380
largest emergency preparedness company

2014
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serving millions of customers for more

2015
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than a decade in fact they're the only

2016
01:36:09,050 --> 01:36:05,880
source my family trusts for our

2017
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preparedness plan you should too right

2018
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now save 20 off a full four week supply

2019
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of delicious meals that provide 2 000

2020
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calories a day saving 20 helps too

2021
01:36:23,390 --> 01:36:20,880
doesn't it especially now so go to

2022
01:36:25,030 --> 01:36:23,400
prepare with Jimmy me.com and get ready

2023
01:36:27,649 --> 01:36:25,040
that's

2024
01:36:30,709 --> 01:36:27,659
preparewithjimmy.com there's no time to

2025
01:36:33,890 --> 01:36:30,719
lose do it now

2026
01:36:37,430 --> 01:36:33,900
so you love talk radio then you'll love

2027
01:36:40,370 --> 01:36:37,440
talk streamlive.com talk stream live is

2028
01:36:42,470 --> 01:36:40,380
always on 24 7 with the best streaming

2029
01:36:44,510 --> 01:36:42,480
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2030
01:36:47,209 --> 01:36:44,520
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2031
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2032
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2033
01:36:54,050 --> 01:36:51,480
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2034
01:36:56,750 --> 01:36:54,060
place has gotten a whole lot easier just

2035
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go to talkstreamlive.com be sure to

2036
01:37:01,970 --> 01:36:58,679
download the free apps from Google Play

2037
01:37:05,050 --> 01:37:01,980
or the iTunes app store

2038
01:37:07,220 --> 01:37:05,060
you listen to us and we listen to you

2039
01:37:09,430 --> 01:37:07,230
and so does the CIA

2040
01:37:12,110 --> 01:37:09,440
[Music]

2041
01:37:13,790 --> 01:37:12,120
hi I'm Ray sobbs and I'm here to tell

2042
01:37:15,890 --> 01:37:13,800
you about something I really think

2043
01:37:18,229 --> 01:37:15,900
you're gonna like the annex network is a

2044
01:37:20,510 --> 01:37:18,239
part of a larger group called annexed

2045
01:37:23,209 --> 01:37:20,520
media and one of the things we offer is

2046
01:37:25,310 --> 01:37:23,219
the quarterly unex magazine which is

2047
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available both in print and digital

2048
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formats this amazing magazine covers all

2049
01:37:33,290 --> 01:37:30,600
aspects of The Unexplained and makes for

2050
01:37:34,850 --> 01:37:33,300
a great coffee table periodical that is

2051
01:37:37,370 --> 01:37:34,860
certain to spark in lightning

2052
01:37:38,689 --> 01:37:37,380
conversations in your living rooms we

2053
01:37:41,350 --> 01:37:38,699
invite you to check out the latest

2054
01:37:43,310 --> 01:37:41,360
digital issue for free just go to

2055
01:37:45,470 --> 01:37:43,320
annexnetwork.com forward slash

2056
01:37:47,629 --> 01:37:45,480
membership and fill out your free

2057
01:37:50,149 --> 01:37:47,639
membership with your name and email and

2058
01:37:52,850 --> 01:37:50,159
become a new free member the new summer

2059
01:37:55,490 --> 01:37:52,860
issue is now available and the theme is

2060
01:37:57,410 --> 01:37:55,500
time anomalies which includes a feature

2061
01:38:00,290 --> 01:37:57,420
article written by our managing editor

2062
01:38:02,590 --> 01:38:00,300
Lee Spiegel just go to annexnetwork.com

2063
01:38:04,729 --> 01:38:02,600
forward slash memberships that's

2064
01:38:07,490 --> 01:38:04,739
annexnetwork.com forward slash

2065
01:38:12,110 --> 01:38:07,500
memberships and get your free e-copy of

2066
01:38:18,520 --> 01:38:14,689
you are listening to face tag with Jimmy

2067
01:38:22,070 --> 01:38:20,110
[Music]

2068
01:38:25,189 --> 01:38:22,080
Networks you're listening to Jimmy

2069
01:38:28,850 --> 01:38:25,199
church this is Revolution the revolution

2070
01:38:30,649 --> 01:38:28,860
will not be televised the revolution is

2071
01:38:34,250 --> 01:38:30,659
on radio

2072
01:39:05,530 --> 01:38:42,669
[Music]

2073
01:39:05,540 --> 01:39:08,960
[Applause]

2074
01:39:16,310 --> 01:39:13,970
[Music]

2075
01:39:19,610 --> 01:39:16,320
Welcome Back Fade to Black I'm assuming

2076
01:39:23,450 --> 01:39:19,620
church tonight Richard Dolan is with us

2077
01:39:25,310 --> 01:39:23,460
huge week for the community and you know

2078
01:39:27,770 --> 01:39:25,320
seeking answers

2079
01:39:30,649 --> 01:39:27,780
it's just a huge week and uh tonight

2080
01:39:33,709 --> 01:39:30,659
Richard uh is with us I know that uh

2081
01:39:35,810 --> 01:39:33,719
Richard you have had a very busy very

2082
01:39:38,450 --> 01:39:35,820
busy week with all of this and I want to

2083
01:39:40,010 --> 01:39:38,460
get uh back to uh where we left off uh

2084
01:39:41,629 --> 01:39:40,020
before the break but I just wanted to

2085
01:39:43,750 --> 01:39:41,639
say this

2086
01:39:47,990 --> 01:39:43,760
um and the audience needs to understand

2087
01:39:50,510 --> 01:39:48,000
that uh Richard and I

2088
01:39:53,270 --> 01:39:50,520
um have a method of communicating with

2089
01:39:57,110 --> 01:39:53,280
each other off of the air uh it's kind

2090
01:40:00,530 --> 01:39:57,120
of like family uh we argue we fight we

2091
01:40:03,110 --> 01:40:00,540
we don't necessarily agree on issues but

2092
01:40:05,270 --> 01:40:03,120
we talk through them and and we learn

2093
01:40:07,030 --> 01:40:05,280
from each other and and Rich I just want

2094
01:40:10,129 --> 01:40:07,040
to thank you for that man because

2095
01:40:11,930 --> 01:40:10,139
sometimes it's uh it's uh it gets a

2096
01:40:13,930 --> 01:40:11,940
little it gets a little testy but we

2097
01:40:17,709 --> 01:40:13,940
always walk away as friends

2098
01:40:20,890 --> 01:40:17,719
I appreciate the way we communicate

2099
01:40:23,390 --> 01:40:20,900
people need to you know sometimes people

2100
01:40:25,970 --> 01:40:23,400
think that we're a little bit uh too

2101
01:40:29,510 --> 01:40:25,980
loose with each other but but it just

2102
01:40:31,550 --> 01:40:29,520
comes from trust over the years and so

2103
01:40:33,830 --> 01:40:31,560
yeah I want to thank you for that by the

2104
01:40:36,110 --> 01:40:33,840
way um thank you Jimmy during the break

2105
01:40:38,209 --> 01:40:36,120
I was looking for TRW references in

2106
01:40:40,790 --> 01:40:38,219
those notes and I didn't see them I

2107
01:40:42,709 --> 01:40:40,800
didn't maybe I uh if one of the

2108
01:40:44,689 --> 01:40:42,719
listeners can uh

2109
01:40:46,430 --> 01:40:44,699
who has access to them maybe I I just

2110
01:40:48,649 --> 01:40:46,440
looked too quickly but I didn't I didn't

2111
01:40:51,169 --> 01:40:48,659
see TRW in there I did see a lot of

2112
01:40:52,790 --> 01:40:51,179
other cases at well-known cash Landrum

2113
01:40:54,830 --> 01:40:52,800
the Cuban jet incident they hadn't met

2114
01:40:57,310 --> 01:40:54,840
reference to that

2115
01:41:01,790 --> 01:41:00,410
Waters Ben Waters

2116
01:41:04,070 --> 01:41:01,800
um I'll have to go back and look look

2117
01:41:06,290 --> 01:41:04,080
you and I are the same age I'm depending

2118
01:41:12,370 --> 01:41:06,300
time to uh yeah I'd like to see that TRW

2119
01:41:18,110 --> 01:41:14,930
Richard we're depending on my failing

2120
01:41:21,050 --> 01:41:18,120
brain okay so let's not

2121
01:41:25,010 --> 01:41:21,060
go there but back to

2122
01:41:28,010 --> 01:41:25,020
um uh I keep I will continue to say that

2123
01:41:31,129 --> 01:41:28,020
this is uh Lockheed Skunk Works I I just

2124
01:41:34,310 --> 01:41:31,139
feel that in my heart of hearts so when

2125
01:41:36,050 --> 01:41:34,320
I make this reference uh I I I may say

2126
01:41:37,970 --> 01:41:36,060
that I don't know what is fact but

2127
01:41:39,709 --> 01:41:37,980
that's what I think but going back to

2128
01:41:42,590 --> 01:41:39,719
the meeting with the three head of

2129
01:41:48,109 --> 01:41:42,600
security the the program manager of the

2130
01:41:49,790 --> 01:41:48,119
uh the alien craft and uh uh uh who was

2131
01:41:52,729 --> 01:41:49,800
the third oh the attorney uh

2132
01:41:56,930 --> 01:41:52,739
representing company

2133
01:41:59,450 --> 01:41:56,940
um is is this comment here which I just

2134
01:42:01,490 --> 01:41:59,460
found this to be extreme they're they're

2135
01:42:04,550 --> 01:42:01,500
having a fight they're going through an

2136
01:42:07,070 --> 01:42:04,560
argument and uh and this back and forth

2137
01:42:11,330 --> 01:42:07,080
is going on and then finally they like

2138
01:42:13,370 --> 01:42:11,340
uh they back up and uh they just they

2139
01:42:16,490 --> 01:42:13,380
they tap out I'm talking about Lockheed

2140
01:42:18,350 --> 01:42:16,500
where the program manager said they that

2141
01:42:20,950 --> 01:42:18,360
Lockheed wasn't a weapons program

2142
01:42:24,050 --> 01:42:20,960
Lockheed wasn't an intelligent program

2143
01:42:26,870 --> 01:42:24,060
Lockheed was not a special Lobster a

2144
01:42:28,910 --> 01:42:26,880
logistics program and it doesn't fit any

2145
01:42:31,010 --> 01:42:28,920
of those categories and Thomas Wilson

2146
01:42:33,470 --> 01:42:31,020
says well I asked what they were then

2147
01:42:36,290 --> 01:42:33,480
what are you talking about and a loud

2148
01:42:39,410 --> 01:42:36,300
grown right aside from the program

2149
01:42:44,330 --> 01:42:39,420
manager and the security director says

2150
01:42:46,790 --> 01:42:44,340
it's okay to say it and well say what uh

2151
01:42:50,570 --> 01:42:46,800
Eric Davis says say what and Thomas

2152
01:42:52,850 --> 01:42:50,580
Wilson says they were a reverse

2153
01:42:54,830 --> 01:42:52,860
engineering program something was

2154
01:42:58,129 --> 01:42:54,840
recovered years ago in the past

2155
01:42:59,870 --> 01:42:58,139
technology technological Hardware was

2156
01:43:02,990 --> 01:42:59,880
recovered so I thought that they met

2157
01:43:05,770 --> 01:43:03,000
Soviet Chinese and that's an honest you

2158
01:43:07,669 --> 01:43:05,780
know I could see that right uh

2159
01:43:10,850 --> 01:43:07,679
I actually couldn't

2160
01:43:12,890 --> 01:43:10,860
okay okay well but it's the way that he

2161
01:43:15,109 --> 01:43:12,900
says it here uh I think he's playing

2162
01:43:17,090 --> 01:43:15,119
dumb like you know he went there because

2163
01:43:19,609 --> 01:43:17,100
he had been told

2164
01:43:22,010 --> 01:43:19,619
by Greer and by you know uh Mitchell and

2165
01:43:25,609 --> 01:43:22,020
that this was an E.T there was an ET

2166
01:43:28,189 --> 01:43:25,619
related program oh so you're thinking

2167
01:43:28,970 --> 01:43:28,199
um well okay I mean you know that's what

2168
01:43:32,209 --> 01:43:28,980
I think

2169
01:43:35,930 --> 01:43:32,219
well and so I said uh

2170
01:43:39,109 --> 01:43:35,940
he says uh like a missile or Intel uh

2171
01:43:41,330 --> 01:43:39,119
platform or aircraft actually I came to

2172
01:43:42,590 --> 01:43:41,340
meeting expecting to find a sensitive

2173
01:43:45,109 --> 01:43:42,600
foreign collection in reverse

2174
01:43:47,390 --> 01:43:45,119
engineering operation thought UFOs used

2175
01:43:54,290 --> 01:43:47,400
as a cover

2176
01:43:57,109 --> 01:43:54,300
for that okay so okay uh so I said that

2177
01:44:01,330 --> 01:43:57,119
right that UFO was a cover for some

2178
01:44:06,950 --> 01:44:04,390
that they weren't that either

2179
01:44:10,189 --> 01:44:06,960
the program manager

2180
01:44:12,830 --> 01:44:10,199
said that they had a craft

2181
01:44:16,669 --> 01:44:12,840
an intact craft and this is what I think

2182
01:44:18,950 --> 01:44:16,679
is key here that they believed could fly

2183
01:44:22,910 --> 01:44:18,960
right but they couldn't they couldn't

2184
01:44:25,669 --> 01:44:22,920
get it off the ground right that uh uh

2185
01:44:27,770 --> 01:44:25,679
he goes on and he says you know if your

2186
01:44:30,590 --> 01:44:27,780
quote right not from this Earth not made

2187
01:44:32,629 --> 01:44:30,600
by man not by human hands

2188
01:44:36,050 --> 01:44:32,639
um and this is the page that you had

2189
01:44:38,510 --> 01:44:36,060
seen this is page 13 that you had seen

2190
01:44:42,649 --> 01:44:38,520
about 10 years before correct

2191
01:44:45,950 --> 01:44:42,659
in 2006 yeah yeah 2006.

2192
01:44:47,570 --> 01:44:45,960
um and where they go on to say uh I'm

2193
01:44:49,490 --> 01:44:47,580
gonna pull this down

2194
01:44:51,410 --> 01:44:49,500
um that it was slow going

2195
01:44:53,750 --> 01:44:51,420
that they they just couldn't make any

2196
01:44:55,810 --> 01:44:53,760
progress in the reverse engineering of

2197
01:44:58,450 --> 01:44:55,820
this craft and again I think that's it

2198
01:45:00,229 --> 01:44:58,460
maybe that wasn't true

2199
01:45:02,090 --> 01:45:00,239
uh-huh

2200
01:45:04,070 --> 01:45:02,100
yeah we have to keep in mind I I don't

2201
01:45:06,530 --> 01:45:04,080
have any reason to doubt that Wilson

2202
01:45:08,090 --> 01:45:06,540
told Eric Davis the truth as he knew it

2203
01:45:10,129 --> 01:45:08,100
well mate you know actually I shouldn't

2204
01:45:12,290 --> 01:45:10,139
say that he might have held things back

2205
01:45:14,689 --> 01:45:12,300
from Davis even though he

2206
01:45:17,149 --> 01:45:14,699
uh was told that he could trust Davis we

2207
01:45:18,890 --> 01:45:17,159
I don't really know I do believe that

2208
01:45:21,649 --> 01:45:18,900
Davis Faithfully recorded the

2209
01:45:23,750 --> 01:45:21,659
conversation so I think we can save that

2210
01:45:27,169 --> 01:45:23,760
um I think we can say Wilson probably

2211
01:45:28,729 --> 01:45:27,179
was relatively up front with Davis he

2212
01:45:30,890 --> 01:45:28,739
might have been completely truthful he

2213
01:45:33,530 --> 01:45:30,900
might have held a few things back very

2214
01:45:35,570 --> 01:45:33,540
probably did uh just to protect maybe

2215
01:45:37,990 --> 01:45:35,580
individuals that he had been working

2216
01:45:40,609 --> 01:45:38,000
under or working with totally possible

2217
01:45:42,649 --> 01:45:40,619
totally possible so that Davis's

2218
01:45:45,109 --> 01:45:42,659
information would have been honest but

2219
01:45:47,689 --> 01:45:45,119
it wouldn't from Davis's point but it

2220
01:45:48,770 --> 01:45:47,699
might not have been you know Wilson we

2221
01:45:50,149 --> 01:45:48,780
don't know that he told him everything

2222
01:45:52,189 --> 01:45:50,159
that

2223
01:45:54,229 --> 01:45:52,199
did he just like open everything up and

2224
01:45:56,090 --> 01:45:54,239
tell him everything that's possibly not

2225
01:45:57,709 --> 01:45:56,100
the case and certainly the the people

2226
01:46:00,229 --> 01:45:57,719
who were briefing Wilson

2227
01:46:04,790 --> 01:46:00,239
I think that they had every reason

2228
01:46:06,169 --> 01:46:04,800
to be uh parsimonious with the truth

2229
01:46:07,370 --> 01:46:06,179
there are probably certain things that

2230
01:46:09,050 --> 01:46:07,380
they would have told him just to shut

2231
01:46:13,010 --> 01:46:09,060
him the hell up and get him off their

2232
01:46:14,990 --> 01:46:13,020
back but but would they have told him

2233
01:46:17,570 --> 01:46:15,000
would they have needed to tell him

2234
01:46:19,010 --> 01:46:17,580
everything what if they had made

2235
01:46:22,510 --> 01:46:19,020
significant progress and they didn't

2236
01:46:26,930 --> 01:46:24,830
they might just say yeah we're working

2237
01:46:28,430 --> 01:46:26,940
on it we haven't made any progress maybe

2238
01:46:30,050 --> 01:46:28,440
it's the truth what they said to him but

2239
01:46:34,010 --> 01:46:30,060
maybe it wasn't the truth

2240
01:46:36,350 --> 01:46:34,020
do you think um there was a reason

2241
01:46:39,350 --> 01:46:36,360
um well no let me ask you this do you

2242
01:46:41,870 --> 01:46:39,360
think that Thomas Wilson took a tour of

2243
01:46:44,810 --> 01:46:41,880
the facility that day do you think that

2244
01:46:46,550 --> 01:46:44,820
they showed him the craft

2245
01:46:48,470 --> 01:46:46,560
I have no way of knowing that it

2246
01:46:51,470 --> 01:46:48,480
certainly does not uh figure into the

2247
01:46:53,629 --> 01:46:51,480
notes at all right because it's clearly

2248
01:46:56,149 --> 01:46:53,639
not mentioned in the notes

2249
01:46:58,850 --> 01:46:56,159
um it is implied in the notes that

2250
01:47:00,770 --> 01:46:58,860
that's what they did with the uh

2251
01:47:02,990 --> 01:47:00,780
original investigator from the Pentagon

2252
01:47:05,629 --> 01:47:03,000
right he said that guy they brought in

2253
01:47:07,310 --> 01:47:05,639
they brought him

2254
01:47:10,250 --> 01:47:07,320
um and then so that part it's like

2255
01:47:12,410 --> 01:47:10,260
leading up to this but Thomas Wilson

2256
01:47:15,350 --> 01:47:12,420
never says that he saw the craft that

2257
01:47:17,330 --> 01:47:15,360
the they got it he did an argument and

2258
01:47:20,870 --> 01:47:17,340
he got on a plane back to Washington to

2259
01:47:24,350 --> 01:47:20,880
do his own follow-up exactly right right

2260
01:47:26,390 --> 01:47:24,360
um uh now going back now here's the

2261
01:47:29,209 --> 01:47:26,400
other interesting thing

2262
01:47:32,330 --> 01:47:29,219
in the oak Shannon notes and I think

2263
01:47:35,810 --> 01:47:32,340
it's in Jack house Notes too

2264
01:47:38,149 --> 01:47:35,820
um is a reference to the arv right the

2265
01:47:42,709 --> 01:47:38,159
alien reproduction vehicle

2266
01:47:46,370 --> 01:47:42,719
and that's in no to 1985. when did Mark

2267
01:47:50,810 --> 01:47:46,380
McCandless start to talk about the arv

2268
01:47:55,669 --> 01:47:50,820
well the arv No No the arvs uh actual

2269
01:47:58,729 --> 01:47:55,679
event was in November of 1988. at Norton

2270
01:48:00,169 --> 01:47:58,739
Air Force Base uh well I think Norton

2271
01:48:01,810 --> 01:48:00,179
was the original cover I think it was

2272
01:48:05,270 --> 01:48:01,820
over at lockheed's Helendale facility

2273
01:48:06,950 --> 01:48:05,280
okay so it was originally stated at

2274
01:48:09,169 --> 01:48:06,960
Norton I think

2275
01:48:11,270 --> 01:48:09,179
um I I think maybe that's how Brad

2276
01:48:13,669 --> 01:48:11,280
Sorensen had Mark McCandless tell the

2277
01:48:15,290 --> 01:48:13,679
story originally but right I think I

2278
01:48:19,070 --> 01:48:15,300
think they flew over to Lockheed uh

2279
01:48:22,250 --> 01:48:19,080
Helendale facility but 19 is in November

2280
01:48:24,430 --> 01:48:22,260
of 1988. this is my connecting of the

2281
01:48:27,530 --> 01:48:24,440
dots Richard

2282
01:48:30,470 --> 01:48:27,540
I see I didn't see the Arab uh

2283
01:48:31,910 --> 01:48:30,480
connection in those notes okay arv is

2284
01:48:33,950 --> 01:48:31,920
written in the notes that they have it

2285
01:48:36,010 --> 01:48:33,960
uh that we have produced an alien

2286
01:48:39,470 --> 01:48:36,020
reproduction vehicle and they call it

2287
01:48:41,810 --> 01:48:39,480
Arc it's possible those notes then would

2288
01:48:43,310 --> 01:48:41,820
have been because the the advanced

2289
01:48:45,770 --> 01:48:43,320
theoretical physics group didn't just

2290
01:48:46,970 --> 01:48:45,780
meet in 1985 they met over a period of

2291
01:48:49,910 --> 01:48:46,980
years

2292
01:48:52,129 --> 01:48:49,920
they met again in 87 it might have met

2293
01:48:53,390 --> 01:48:52,139
in 86 I can't remember and they might

2294
01:48:56,330 --> 01:48:53,400
have met

2295
01:48:58,430 --> 01:48:56,340
um even after 1988 so it would if

2296
01:49:00,109 --> 01:48:58,440
they're mentioning arv then I've got to

2297
01:49:03,530 --> 01:49:00,119
think it's it's after that

2298
01:49:05,510 --> 01:49:03,540
uh no the notes are dated uh May 8th

2299
01:49:07,430 --> 01:49:05,520
1985.

2300
01:49:08,870 --> 01:49:07,440
all right well that's a problem that's

2301
01:49:10,609 --> 01:49:08,880
got to be resolved we've got to figure

2302
01:49:12,070 --> 01:49:10,619
out no I don't think that's a problem I

2303
01:49:15,470 --> 01:49:12,080
think it's confirmation of Mark

2304
01:49:18,410 --> 01:49:15,480
mccandlish's story no it can't be

2305
01:49:22,609 --> 01:49:18,420
because because the story literally

2306
01:49:25,129 --> 01:49:22,619
happened in November 1988. that's Mark

2307
01:49:29,149 --> 01:49:25,139
McCandless saying that he had

2308
01:49:31,070 --> 01:49:29,159
encountered the arv but it's saying that

2309
01:49:32,510 --> 01:49:31,080
Brad Sorensen so you're saying these

2310
01:49:34,870 --> 01:49:32,520
guys would have known about the arv

2311
01:49:38,149 --> 01:49:34,880
themselves

2312
01:49:42,169 --> 01:49:38,159
yes which which I want to see those no

2313
01:49:43,850 --> 01:49:42,179
that's if you can I mean I wish that I

2314
01:49:46,910 --> 01:49:43,860
had uh looked at this a little more

2315
01:49:47,629 --> 01:49:46,920
carefully before we started

2316
01:49:50,149 --> 01:49:47,639
um

2317
01:49:52,669 --> 01:49:50,159
that's a significant find if if that's

2318
01:49:55,070 --> 01:49:52,679
if that's true and I I can't

2319
01:49:57,229 --> 01:49:55,080
say that I know that's true but if it is

2320
01:49:59,390 --> 01:49:57,239
that that is a very that would be very

2321
01:50:02,330 --> 01:49:59,400
significant are you sure about that yeah

2322
01:50:03,590 --> 01:50:02,340
well hold on a second now you just I'm

2323
01:50:06,169 --> 01:50:03,600
not trying to get on your face I'm just

2324
01:50:09,109 --> 01:50:06,179
you just keep you just you're just

2325
01:50:10,310 --> 01:50:09,119
getting excited you just relax there

2326
01:50:13,010 --> 01:50:10,320
young man

2327
01:50:17,810 --> 01:50:13,020
you just relax let me pull it up

2328
01:50:20,330 --> 01:50:17,820
um and I should be able to

2329
01:50:22,729 --> 01:50:20,340
um let me reduce the size of this and

2330
01:50:24,129 --> 01:50:22,739
everybody this is great this is live

2331
01:50:27,590 --> 01:50:24,139
radio

2332
01:50:30,890 --> 01:50:27,600
and uh you know what I can pull it up

2333
01:50:34,550 --> 01:50:30,900
during those 28 pages of notes here but

2334
01:50:36,169 --> 01:50:34,560
uh somebody yes pull them up Jimmy okay

2335
01:50:45,169 --> 01:50:36,179
uh

2336
01:50:46,790 --> 01:50:45,179
is everybody to stay put online up here

2337
01:50:51,169 --> 01:50:46,800
I'm looking as well

2338
01:50:58,570 --> 01:50:54,530
and I can do it during the break and I

2339
01:51:03,649 --> 01:51:02,149
what I found interesting here is is I'm

2340
01:51:07,790 --> 01:51:03,659
looking at the ocean and notes I'm going

2341
01:51:10,010 --> 01:51:07,800
wait a minute arv the arv program

2342
01:51:12,649 --> 01:51:10,020
um we have built uh an alien

2343
01:51:14,810 --> 01:51:12,659
reproduction vehicle and and there's the

2344
01:51:16,750 --> 01:51:14,820
notes I'm going wait a minute so Mark

2345
01:51:20,570 --> 01:51:16,760
McCandless

2346
01:51:23,390 --> 01:51:20,580
uh that original conference that he went

2347
01:51:26,390 --> 01:51:23,400
to and he has dated that and I was I

2348
01:51:30,169 --> 01:51:26,400
knew it was in the late 80s so this is

2349
01:51:32,629 --> 01:51:30,179
confirmation you know by three years uh

2350
01:51:35,330 --> 01:51:32,639
before Mark McCandless you know tells

2351
01:51:36,950 --> 01:51:35,340
the story right and scrolling through

2352
01:51:39,350 --> 01:51:36,960
these now as you I'm listening to you

2353
01:51:44,709 --> 01:51:39,360
and I'm looking at my version of the

2354
01:51:46,970 --> 01:51:44,719
notes uh for anything that refers to arv

2355
01:51:48,709 --> 01:51:46,980
people who know these notes better than

2356
01:51:50,990 --> 01:51:48,719
both of us and they're like you idiot

2357
01:51:53,209 --> 01:51:51,000
sits on page whatever or you idiots it's

2358
01:51:57,609 --> 01:51:53,219
not there yeah somebody give me the page

2359
01:52:00,609 --> 01:51:57,619
number so I can just scroll to it

2360
01:52:04,010 --> 01:52:00,619
but I'll pull it up and

2361
01:52:05,689 --> 01:52:04,020
if it's not in Oak Shannon's notes and

2362
01:52:08,990 --> 01:52:05,699
that's where I thought that I saw it it

2363
01:52:12,530 --> 01:52:09,000
may be in Jack houck's note

2364
01:52:15,229 --> 01:52:12,540
um but nonetheless it is here

2365
01:52:18,229 --> 01:52:15,239
and I am going to find you because

2366
01:52:20,030 --> 01:52:18,239
according to Brad Sorensen's telling of

2367
01:52:21,770 --> 01:52:20,040
this to McCandless

2368
01:52:23,330 --> 01:52:21,780
and again I'm sure there's some

2369
01:52:24,770 --> 01:52:23,340
listeners who know exactly what you and

2370
01:52:27,290 --> 01:52:24,780
I are talking about there are some

2371
01:52:29,810 --> 01:52:27,300
listeners who probably do not and just a

2372
01:52:32,149 --> 01:52:29,820
very quick recap in 1988 so Brad

2373
01:52:34,490 --> 01:52:32,159
Sorensen was an aerospace executive Mark

2374
01:52:36,530 --> 01:52:34,500
mccandlish was maybe the world's best

2375
01:52:38,390 --> 01:52:36,540
Aviation illustrator Aerospace

2376
01:52:40,550 --> 01:52:38,400
illustrator the guy was amazing of

2377
01:52:42,770 --> 01:52:40,560
course he died recently and that was a

2378
01:52:44,750 --> 01:52:42,780
horrible tragedy

2379
01:52:45,950 --> 01:52:44,760
but uh they were very good friends and

2380
01:52:48,229 --> 01:52:45,960
they were going to go to an air show

2381
01:52:50,930 --> 01:52:48,239
together and at the last minute

2382
01:52:53,209 --> 01:52:50,940
McCandless could not go we had deadlines

2383
01:52:55,970 --> 01:52:53,219
whatever and Sorensen goes and is

2384
01:52:58,669 --> 01:52:55,980
accompanied by a high ranking defense

2385
01:53:02,450 --> 01:52:58,679
official whose identity has never been

2386
01:53:04,430 --> 01:53:02,460
fully confirmed lots of speculation this

2387
01:53:07,070 --> 01:53:04,440
or that but if someone very high up and

2388
01:53:08,930 --> 01:53:07,080
who says apparently the Sorensen hey

2389
01:53:10,910 --> 01:53:08,940
there's I got a better show for you than

2390
01:53:13,010 --> 01:53:10,920
this Air Show and they get into I think

2391
01:53:14,149 --> 01:53:13,020
it's a helicopter and they go to

2392
01:53:17,689 --> 01:53:14,159
Lockheed

2393
01:53:19,430 --> 01:53:17,699
and uh according to what I I've learned

2394
01:53:20,990 --> 01:53:19,440
and probably other people learned this

2395
01:53:22,790 --> 01:53:21,000
was heavily guarded guys with machine

2396
01:53:25,910 --> 01:53:22,800
guns the whole thing very heavy security

2397
01:53:27,709 --> 01:53:25,920
the big shot says to Sorensen don't say

2398
01:53:29,810 --> 01:53:27,719
a word I'll get you in

2399
01:53:31,910 --> 01:53:29,820
they go in and it's in What's called the

2400
01:53:34,669 --> 01:53:31,920
big Hangar Lockheed there's a huge

2401
01:53:38,810 --> 01:53:34,679
curtain dividing it and on one side our

2402
01:53:41,270 --> 01:53:38,820
uh exotic uh but like losing comp losing

2403
01:53:43,490 --> 01:53:41,280
prototypes that did not get

2404
01:53:45,530 --> 01:53:43,500
um approved for mass production but they

2405
01:53:49,370 --> 01:53:45,540
were still amazing behind the curtain

2406
01:53:51,470 --> 01:53:49,380
were three hovering flying saucers

2407
01:53:55,010 --> 01:53:51,480
um and of different sizes nickname Baby

2408
01:53:56,510 --> 01:53:55,020
Bear Mama Bear Papa Bear uh Sorensen

2409
01:53:58,129 --> 01:53:56,520
gave the specs to McCandless who then

2410
01:54:00,290 --> 01:53:58,139
drew it and that drawing is famous it's

2411
01:54:02,870 --> 01:54:00,300
all over the Internet uh but Sorensen

2412
01:54:05,570 --> 01:54:02,880
said he also had there was a four star

2413
01:54:07,790 --> 01:54:05,580
who was lecturing on these craft and he

2414
01:54:09,890 --> 01:54:07,800
referred to them as the arv the alien

2415
01:54:13,370 --> 01:54:09,900
reproduction vehicle

2416
01:54:15,530 --> 01:54:13,380
so so according to that version of it

2417
01:54:17,649 --> 01:54:15,540
that phrase would have been used

2418
01:54:20,629 --> 01:54:17,659
presumably

2419
01:54:24,350 --> 01:54:20,639
uh prior to 1988.

2420
01:54:27,770 --> 01:54:24,360
so if there is a reference to the arv in

2421
01:54:30,590 --> 01:54:27,780
these notes I'm still scrolling somebody

2422
01:54:33,770 --> 01:54:30,600
says it's on page eight

2423
01:54:36,530 --> 01:54:33,780
so they're saying it is true yeah I know

2424
01:54:37,790 --> 01:54:36,540
I read it myself I've got page eight

2425
01:54:39,950 --> 01:54:37,800
here in front of me now so I'm just

2426
01:54:42,890 --> 01:54:39,960
scrolling it's handwritten notes this

2427
01:54:46,080 --> 01:54:42,900
handwriting is not too bad uh

2428
01:54:48,350 --> 01:54:46,090
uh let's see here scrolling

2429
01:54:50,870 --> 01:54:48,360
[Music]

2430
01:54:51,970 --> 01:54:50,880
scrolling

2431
01:54:53,510 --> 01:54:51,980
okay

2432
01:54:56,629 --> 01:54:53,520
[Music]

2433
01:54:59,450 --> 01:54:56,639
what page am I on I just am I just that

2434
01:55:02,090 --> 01:54:59,460
out of it uh are the pages I'm looking

2435
01:55:09,310 --> 01:55:02,100
at page eight on the PDF

2436
01:55:16,510 --> 01:55:13,250
I want to believe

2437
01:55:19,370 --> 01:55:16,520
I'm going on page nine I write it myself

2438
01:55:21,890 --> 01:55:19,380
so I know it's here guys I'm gonna I'm

2439
01:55:24,890 --> 01:55:21,900
gonna believe over the break

2440
01:55:26,689 --> 01:55:24,900
I'm gonna look this over as well

2441
01:55:29,510 --> 01:55:26,699
so here's the thing I just I would say

2442
01:55:33,410 --> 01:55:29,520
this if if this is the case

2443
01:55:35,450 --> 01:55:33,420
if arv is referenced in these notes from

2444
01:55:39,109 --> 01:55:35,460
1985 that's

2445
01:55:40,850 --> 01:55:39,119
I mean look that's significant uh I just

2446
01:55:42,649 --> 01:55:40,860
I'm not seeing it what's wrong with it

2447
01:55:45,770 --> 01:55:42,659
oh it's here it's here it's here I'm

2448
01:55:47,810 --> 01:55:45,780
going to go through jack house

2449
01:55:51,890 --> 01:55:47,820
oh it was one of those things where I

2450
01:55:55,129 --> 01:55:51,900
went okay uh this is a bit much

2451
01:55:57,890 --> 01:55:55,139
okay this is just too many dots are

2452
01:56:00,290 --> 01:55:57,900
being connected here so

2453
01:56:02,330 --> 01:56:00,300
um now somebody said page eight page

2454
01:56:04,850 --> 01:56:02,340
eight of what I'm looking at his

2455
01:56:07,609 --> 01:56:04,860
handwritten so I see Paige his page four

2456
01:56:09,229 --> 01:56:07,619
is actually page seven so his page five

2457
01:56:12,709 --> 01:56:09,239
Page Six

2458
01:56:17,570 --> 01:56:12,719
page seven I'm going to his page eight

2459
01:56:26,330 --> 01:56:20,629
UFOs against rotating oh yeah his

2460
01:56:31,430 --> 01:56:29,330
Don Campbell it's at the Don Campbell

2461
01:56:32,870 --> 01:56:31,440
page is this exciting radio or is this

2462
01:56:35,090 --> 01:56:32,880
boring man I can't tell because we're

2463
01:56:36,890 --> 01:56:35,100
not saying anything well

2464
01:56:40,250 --> 01:56:36,900
um we're looking for something

2465
01:56:42,109 --> 01:56:40,260
but and back to my point though uh and

2466
01:56:43,850 --> 01:56:42,119
I'll find it during the break I'll I'll

2467
01:56:45,729 --> 01:56:43,860
and Richard you can look at it during

2468
01:56:49,970 --> 01:56:45,739
the break

2469
01:56:52,129 --> 01:56:49,980
the arv that reference those three

2470
01:56:54,109 --> 01:56:52,139
letters are significant because this is

2471
01:56:56,450 --> 01:56:54,119
something that Mark McCandless not only

2472
01:56:59,450 --> 01:56:56,460
you know I have I have his paintings

2473
01:57:02,450 --> 01:56:59,460
here and and signed I have a big

2474
01:57:04,669 --> 01:57:02,460
blueprint that he signed for me and he

2475
01:57:07,669 --> 01:57:04,679
did presentations at the citizens

2476
01:57:10,129 --> 01:57:07,679
hearing you remember that exactly

2477
01:57:13,370 --> 01:57:10,139
um I think you were there right

2478
01:57:14,810 --> 01:57:13,380
yes yes I other than Steve Bassett I

2479
01:57:17,330 --> 01:57:14,820
actually gave more presentations of that

2480
01:57:21,550 --> 01:57:17,340
than any other person best 10 minutes of

2481
01:57:26,750 --> 01:57:24,169
I gave many presentations I was back I

2482
01:57:29,450 --> 01:57:26,760
was Steve bassett's uh utility player

2483
01:57:31,609 --> 01:57:29,460
yeah somebody somebody had to yeah yeah

2484
01:57:34,010 --> 01:57:31,619
yeah yeah somebody had to step in but

2485
01:57:36,350 --> 01:57:34,020
but here's the thing

2486
01:57:40,370 --> 01:57:36,360
um Mark had been out there for so long

2487
01:57:42,709 --> 01:57:40,380
talking about the arv and that was his

2488
01:57:46,370 --> 01:57:42,719
uh you know that was his event and then

2489
01:57:50,629 --> 01:57:46,380
I turned around and I see it in notes uh

2490
01:57:53,149 --> 01:57:50,639
uh preceding him by three years

2491
01:57:55,370 --> 01:57:53,159
okay well we're gonna have to nail this

2492
01:57:58,370 --> 01:57:55,380
down because this that would be a very

2493
01:58:00,770 --> 01:57:58,380
as with the TR the TRW which I'm not

2494
01:58:02,450 --> 01:58:00,780
seeing in here yet but

2495
01:58:04,669 --> 01:58:02,460
um the arv that would actually even be

2496
01:58:08,270 --> 01:58:04,679
more significant to see that in here

2497
01:58:10,790 --> 01:58:08,280
somebody just said the arv story I think

2498
01:58:13,669 --> 01:58:10,800
there are many uh people who do believe

2499
01:58:16,370 --> 01:58:13,679
it and a lot of very

2500
01:58:19,129 --> 01:58:16,380
like people whose opinions we need to

2501
01:58:20,450 --> 01:58:19,139
respect who believe it

2502
01:58:22,490 --> 01:58:20,460
um there are a number of people who

2503
01:58:24,589 --> 01:58:22,500
interviewed Brad Sorensen privately I

2504
01:58:26,390 --> 01:58:24,599
mean I'm aware of this I've never been

2505
01:58:28,550 --> 01:58:26,400
able to speak to him but

2506
01:58:30,350 --> 01:58:28,560
I know people who did interview him and

2507
01:58:33,709 --> 01:58:30,360
were quite satisfied

2508
01:58:35,450 --> 01:58:33,719
that he was completely truthful

2509
01:58:37,070 --> 01:58:35,460
about that but we still don't have a

2510
01:58:38,330 --> 01:58:37,080
confirmation

2511
01:58:39,830 --> 01:58:38,340
there's no document there's no

2512
01:58:41,810 --> 01:58:39,840
government confirmation so if we can

2513
01:58:44,330 --> 01:58:41,820
find that in these notes

2514
01:58:47,270 --> 01:58:44,340
that that would be a significant

2515
01:58:51,350 --> 01:58:47,280
uh support for their for the reality of

2516
01:58:53,330 --> 01:58:51,360
that would you be surprised because of

2517
01:58:55,250 --> 01:58:53,340
the Wilson Davis notes were so now part

2518
01:58:56,750 --> 01:58:55,260
of the Congressional Record right we

2519
01:59:00,169 --> 01:58:56,760
have that yeah

2520
01:59:01,850 --> 01:59:00,179
um and that these notes now uh if if

2521
01:59:04,129 --> 01:59:01,860
they have another hearing I would expect

2522
01:59:06,410 --> 01:59:04,139
that these two sets of notes are brought

2523
01:59:09,229 --> 01:59:06,420
into the record too as well

2524
01:59:11,510 --> 01:59:09,239
um would you be surprised if if Eric

2525
01:59:12,709 --> 01:59:11,520
Davis or Admiral Wilson are asked to

2526
01:59:15,050 --> 01:59:12,719
testify

2527
01:59:18,229 --> 01:59:15,060
we're giving them a road map aren't we

2528
01:59:20,390 --> 01:59:18,239
are we surprised I would be surprised

2529
01:59:22,310 --> 01:59:20,400
that they would be asked or you would be

2530
01:59:23,870 --> 01:59:22,320
surprised if they would appear

2531
01:59:25,850 --> 01:59:23,880
yeah the latter I think I would be

2532
01:59:27,589 --> 01:59:25,860
surprised that they would appear I I

2533
01:59:29,330 --> 01:59:27,599
would love to be wrong

2534
01:59:31,790 --> 01:59:29,340
I would like to be wrong

2535
01:59:34,010 --> 01:59:31,800
I I have not changed my opinion on on

2536
01:59:36,229 --> 01:59:34,020
one element of UFO disclosure which is

2537
01:59:38,089 --> 01:59:36,239
that it is so radical so revolutionary

2538
01:59:40,970 --> 01:59:38,099
so disruptive

2539
01:59:42,890 --> 01:59:40,980
uh there's too much there's too much

2540
01:59:46,850 --> 01:59:42,900
against it and um

2541
01:59:48,589 --> 01:59:46,860
not only that but the the level you know

2542
01:59:50,209 --> 01:59:48,599
when you study the notes the Davis's

2543
01:59:52,850 --> 01:59:50,219
notes that

2544
01:59:56,209 --> 01:59:52,860
the kind of the the depth of the secrecy

2545
01:59:58,129 --> 01:59:56,219
the Labyrinthian nature of this the fact

2546
02:00:01,729 --> 01:59:58,139
that you've got I mean essentially what

2547
02:00:04,250 --> 02:00:01,739
you have is these nodes tell us you've

2548
02:00:06,410 --> 02:00:04,260
got probably billion dollar UFO reverse

2549
02:00:09,290 --> 02:00:06,420
engineering programs that are being

2550
02:00:11,990 --> 02:00:09,300
managed by corporate contractors hiding

2551
02:00:15,530 --> 02:00:12,000
behind sub programs of other legitimate

2552
02:00:17,209 --> 02:00:15,540
saps special access programs so it's and

2553
02:00:19,310 --> 02:00:17,219
and and and

2554
02:00:22,490 --> 02:00:19,320
my read of this is that they were using

2555
02:00:24,890 --> 02:00:22,500
false descriptions in the directory

2556
02:00:26,990 --> 02:00:24,900
which was one of the difficulties that

2557
02:00:29,149 --> 02:00:27,000
Wilson had in in finding them that seems

2558
02:00:31,729 --> 02:00:29,159
to be illegal to me

2559
02:00:33,410 --> 02:00:31,739
um but what's that definitely clear is

2560
02:00:35,810 --> 02:00:33,420
they had

2561
02:00:38,089 --> 02:00:35,820
basically we're using they were using

2562
02:00:39,050 --> 02:00:38,099
the special access uh program oversight

2563
02:00:41,149 --> 02:00:39,060
committee

2564
02:00:42,890 --> 02:00:41,159
to maintain their own deep deep deep

2565
02:00:44,810 --> 02:00:42,900
secrecy

2566
02:00:47,030 --> 02:00:44,820
they're able to make that group do their

2567
02:00:49,370 --> 02:00:47,040
own bidding essentially and and you know

2568
02:00:52,729 --> 02:00:49,380
the other thing is that Wilson goes back

2569
02:00:54,649 --> 02:00:52,739
he he's he found a legitimate lack of

2570
02:00:57,830 --> 02:00:54,659
oversight

2571
02:01:00,770 --> 02:00:57,840
uh of this program and instead of being

2572
02:01:03,169 --> 02:01:00,780
praised for finding this he gets uh

2573
02:01:05,570 --> 02:01:03,179
threatened with his career

2574
02:01:07,189 --> 02:01:05,580
and actually really did prove true like

2575
02:01:09,229 --> 02:01:07,199
the the statements that I think Greer

2576
02:01:11,030 --> 02:01:09,239
was saying back in April of 97 that

2577
02:01:13,070 --> 02:01:11,040
you've been this is like a rogue

2578
02:01:16,250 --> 02:01:13,080
operation

2579
02:01:18,709 --> 02:01:16,260
so that's a significant

2580
02:01:21,649 --> 02:01:18,719
level of it's not just secrecy I mean

2581
02:01:23,570 --> 02:01:21,659
arguably it's deep criminality you could

2582
02:01:25,609 --> 02:01:23,580
really make this case I mean they would

2583
02:01:27,589 --> 02:01:25,619
have their own argument to say no this

2584
02:01:30,050 --> 02:01:27,599
is not criminal it's not illegal I've

2585
02:01:31,609 --> 02:01:30,060
often called it legal illegality you

2586
02:01:33,589 --> 02:01:31,619
know it's it's essentially it's illegal

2587
02:01:35,750 --> 02:01:33,599
but they've they are hiding between

2588
02:01:36,950 --> 02:01:35,760
behind some kind of fig Leaf of legality

2589
02:01:38,810 --> 02:01:36,960
but

2590
02:01:40,370 --> 02:01:38,820
these people do not want to be exposed

2591
02:01:42,470 --> 02:01:40,380
they're going to do anything to stop

2592
02:01:43,850 --> 02:01:42,480
being exposed

2593
02:01:46,669 --> 02:01:43,860
so

2594
02:01:48,890 --> 02:01:46,679
um I would be shocked if if Eric Davis

2595
02:01:51,950 --> 02:01:48,900
or Thomas Wilson gets called

2596
02:01:54,229 --> 02:01:51,960
to testify well with Oak Shannon's

2597
02:01:55,850 --> 02:01:54,239
statements you know he is now on the

2598
02:01:59,750 --> 02:01:55,860
record

2599
02:02:01,070 --> 02:01:59,760
um uh there isn't any deniability at

2600
02:02:04,189 --> 02:02:01,080
this point when you have everything

2601
02:02:05,810 --> 02:02:04,199
supported it's direct evidence he was

2602
02:02:07,550 --> 02:02:05,820
already on the record as having said

2603
02:02:10,310 --> 02:02:07,560
that he knew Wilson and Davis he had

2604
02:02:13,810 --> 02:02:10,320
said that previously uh maybe to Billy

2605
02:02:16,430 --> 02:02:13,820
Cox I think Emily so

2606
02:02:18,890 --> 02:02:16,440
he called Admiral Wilson about this

2607
02:02:21,530 --> 02:02:18,900
that's right and accepted the denial of

2608
02:02:23,000 --> 02:02:21,540
face value yeah unfortunately

2609
02:02:23,390 --> 02:02:23,010
um but

2610
02:02:24,589 --> 02:02:23,400
[Music]

2611
02:02:27,350 --> 02:02:24,599
um

2612
02:02:28,970 --> 02:02:27,360
I I just I I don't have a lot of

2613
02:02:31,189 --> 02:02:28,980
confidence that the United States

2614
02:02:33,410 --> 02:02:31,199
Congress is actually going to do a

2615
02:02:35,450 --> 02:02:33,420
proper job on this investigation I just

2616
02:02:37,149 --> 02:02:35,460
really don't think that they will I'd

2617
02:02:40,430 --> 02:02:37,159
love to be proven wrong

2618
02:02:44,689 --> 02:02:40,440
we have uh two things that were supposed

2619
02:02:46,910 --> 02:02:44,699
to happen this year uh or three

2620
02:02:48,830 --> 02:02:46,920
um haven't happened yet one we didn't

2621
02:02:51,709 --> 02:02:48,840
get the public uh there were supposed to

2622
02:02:53,810 --> 02:02:51,719
be two reports filed uh this year uh

2623
02:02:57,470 --> 02:02:53,820
there was supposed to be a public uh

2624
02:03:00,410 --> 02:02:57,480
follow-up uh UAP report it was not done

2625
02:03:04,430 --> 02:03:00,420
we are now into the fourth quarter right

2626
02:03:06,890 --> 02:03:04,440
of of uh 2022 and we were supposed to

2627
02:03:08,830 --> 02:03:06,900
get a classified report in December at

2628
02:03:12,950 --> 02:03:08,840
the end of the year

2629
02:03:16,669 --> 02:03:12,960
but yeah two days Richard two days

2630
02:03:20,390 --> 02:03:16,679
really oh wow October 1st yes oh my God

2631
02:03:21,830 --> 02:03:20,400
you're right don't see you're too smart

2632
02:03:24,470 --> 02:03:21,840
no no I'm thinking it's like early

2633
02:03:26,930 --> 02:03:24,480
September if you say something like that

2634
02:03:29,390 --> 02:03:26,940
I immediately backpedal and go man I'm

2635
02:03:32,810 --> 02:03:29,400
wrong no right now two days fourth

2636
02:03:35,750 --> 02:03:32,820
quarter okay okay are we gonna have

2637
02:03:37,609 --> 02:03:35,760
another Congressional hearing uh uh on

2638
02:03:39,589 --> 02:03:37,619
UFOs number one number two we're going

2639
02:03:42,229 --> 02:03:39,599
to get a public report that was supposed

2640
02:03:44,450 --> 02:03:42,239
to happen back in June and three are we

2641
02:03:46,430 --> 02:03:44,460
going to get the classified report in

2642
02:03:49,070 --> 02:03:46,440
December or are they are they going to

2643
02:03:50,930 --> 02:03:49,080
kick the can down the road

2644
02:03:53,990 --> 02:03:50,940
yeah I I don't think we're going to get

2645
02:03:55,490 --> 02:03:54,000
anything of value out of these people we

2646
02:03:58,189 --> 02:03:55,500
haven't yet

2647
02:04:00,890 --> 02:03:58,199
I I had family members I have one very

2648
02:04:02,990 --> 02:04:00,900
wonderful beautiful elderly Aunt who is

2649
02:04:06,350 --> 02:04:03,000
you know in my in my extended family

2650
02:04:08,149 --> 02:04:06,360
they all love that I've you know gotten

2651
02:04:09,470 --> 02:04:08,159
into this UFO thing I don't think they

2652
02:04:12,229 --> 02:04:09,480
follow it very carefully but they're

2653
02:04:14,510 --> 02:04:12,239
proud and my uh my aunt God bless her

2654
02:04:16,910 --> 02:04:14,520
she just said it's wonderful

2655
02:04:19,129 --> 02:04:16,920
you're getting you know you're um what

2656
02:04:20,930 --> 02:04:19,139
did she say Vindication I'm like well

2657
02:04:23,390 --> 02:04:20,940
that's good when I when I watch the

2658
02:04:26,810 --> 02:04:23,400
hearings though in May I thought that

2659
02:04:30,229 --> 02:04:26,820
was just the most

2660
02:04:35,709 --> 02:04:30,239
uh I mean absolutely lame it was just so

2661
02:04:39,890 --> 02:04:37,970
that was a high point yeah Gallagher

2662
02:04:42,589 --> 02:04:39,900
mentioned that that was good that was

2663
02:04:45,490 --> 02:04:42,599
good Richard we just flew through we

2664
02:04:48,770 --> 02:04:45,500
just blew through a commercial break

2665
02:04:51,470 --> 02:04:48,780
your money Jimmy yeah you gotta make

2666
02:04:54,109 --> 02:04:51,480
that money no I did it because I thought

2667
02:04:56,149 --> 02:04:54,119
that I was dumb

2668
02:04:58,310 --> 02:04:56,159
that we weren't in the fourth quarter

2669
02:05:05,000 --> 02:04:58,320
thank you Richard we'll be right back

2670
02:05:07,840 --> 02:05:06,609
[Music]

2671
02:05:14,190 --> 02:05:07,850
hi everybody

2672
02:05:18,290 --> 02:05:15,830
[Music]

2673
02:05:19,870 --> 02:05:18,300
you're one million gigawatt paranormal

2674
02:05:24,169 --> 02:05:19,880
Powerhouse

2675
02:05:28,850 --> 02:05:26,689
the Believers the chilling true story of

2676
02:05:31,010 --> 02:05:28,860
Dr John Mack a renowned Harvard

2677
02:05:33,830 --> 02:05:31,020
psychiatrist and pillar to Prize winner

2678
02:05:36,410 --> 02:05:33,840
this is a outreach program from the

2679
02:05:38,570 --> 02:05:36,420
cosmos to the consciously impaired you

2680
02:05:41,169 --> 02:05:38,580
risked it all to investigate human

2681
02:05:44,450 --> 02:05:41,179
encounters with aliens the believer

2682
02:05:46,609 --> 02:05:44,460
alien encounters hard science and the

2683
02:05:48,410 --> 02:05:46,619
passion of John Mack written by

2684
02:05:50,689 --> 02:05:48,420
award-winning former New York Times

2685
02:05:53,149 --> 02:05:50,699
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2686
02:05:54,649 --> 02:05:53,159
now available in paperbot from high road

2687
02:05:56,750 --> 02:05:54,659
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2688
02:05:59,330 --> 02:05:56,760
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2689
02:06:02,149 --> 02:05:59,340
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2690
02:06:04,550 --> 02:06:02,159
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2691
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2692
02:06:09,950 --> 02:06:07,679
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2693
02:06:12,669 --> 02:06:09,960
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2694
02:06:14,930 --> 02:06:12,679
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2695
02:06:17,030 --> 02:06:14,940
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2696
02:06:19,609 --> 02:06:17,040
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2697
02:06:22,189 --> 02:06:19,619
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2698
02:06:25,669 --> 02:06:22,199
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2699
02:06:28,430 --> 02:06:25,679
that's unexmedia.com

2700
02:06:32,030 --> 02:06:28,440
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2701
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02:07:34,550 --> 02:07:32,099
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02:07:37,729 --> 02:07:34,560
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02:07:54,250 --> 02:07:43,080
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2726
02:08:04,129 --> 02:08:01,619
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02:08:08,209 --> 02:08:04,139
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2728
02:08:13,390 --> 02:08:08,219
to brush why Fade to Black because you

2729
02:08:19,609 --> 02:08:15,950
this is Fade to Black with Jimmy Church

2730
02:08:22,690 --> 02:08:19,619
on the game changer Radio Network

2731
02:08:22,700 --> 02:08:36,109
[Music]

2732
02:08:39,649 --> 02:08:37,850
Welcome Back Fade to Black I'm your

2733
02:08:41,990 --> 02:08:39,659
assuming church tonight Richard Dolan is

2734
02:08:45,169 --> 02:08:42,000
with us bombshell week

2735
02:08:51,770 --> 02:08:48,229
tonight is night three we are discussing

2736
02:08:54,709 --> 02:08:51,780
uh the Wilson Davis uh uh document and

2737
02:08:56,570 --> 02:08:54,719
and not only that aspect of it but the

2738
02:08:59,570 --> 02:08:56,580
other things that have happened which

2739
02:09:03,290 --> 02:08:59,580
have been remarkable that is uh the oak

2740
02:09:05,030 --> 02:09:03,300
Shannon notes uh that and I'm going to

2741
02:09:07,010 --> 02:09:05,040
circle back to that because the

2742
02:09:08,870 --> 02:09:07,020
revelation of that is is pretty

2743
02:09:11,209 --> 02:09:08,880
extraordinary

2744
02:09:13,490 --> 02:09:11,219
um and of course Jack Hawks notes and

2745
02:09:17,750 --> 02:09:13,500
Oak Shannon's uh interview that he did

2746
02:09:19,609 --> 02:09:17,760
uh five days ago uh which confirmed not

2747
02:09:23,089 --> 02:09:19,619
only elements of these notes but other

2748
02:09:25,910 --> 02:09:23,099
aspects of this and the players involved

2749
02:09:27,830 --> 02:09:25,920
um Richard I wanted to uh ask you

2750
02:09:30,890 --> 02:09:27,840
directly

2751
02:09:33,890 --> 02:09:30,900
um uh Grant Cameron has had Oak

2752
02:09:35,870 --> 02:09:33,900
Shannon's notes for 20 years

2753
02:09:38,270 --> 02:09:35,880
um he got them

2754
02:09:41,990 --> 02:09:38,280
from Eric Davis

2755
02:09:44,149 --> 02:09:42,000
and I think that that in of itself right

2756
02:09:46,010 --> 02:09:44,159
there which is you know it's it's it's

2757
02:09:49,970 --> 02:09:46,020
it's not

2758
02:09:52,850 --> 02:09:49,980
um uh what circumstantial right I think

2759
02:09:55,070 --> 02:09:52,860
that's a pretty significant uh situation

2760
02:09:57,410 --> 02:09:55,080
here that it came from Eric Davis and

2761
02:10:00,709 --> 02:09:57,420
it's all the same players that keep uh

2762
02:10:04,970 --> 02:10:00,719
repeating uh themselves uh which fold

2763
02:10:10,189 --> 02:10:04,980
into nids and then Eric's exit of nids

2764
02:10:11,990 --> 02:10:10,199
and was he in needs in 2002 and was that

2765
02:10:15,050 --> 02:10:12,000
maybe part of the motivation of

2766
02:10:18,109 --> 02:10:15,060
contacting Admiral Wilson

2767
02:10:20,030 --> 02:10:18,119
I I think I think he was was he still in

2768
02:10:23,149 --> 02:10:20,040
needs by then nids was still operating

2769
02:10:25,729 --> 02:10:23,159
well nidge was what was Eric part of

2770
02:10:27,530 --> 02:10:25,739
Mitch in 2002. left mids at some point I

2771
02:10:29,209 --> 02:10:27,540
don't know I can't I don't remember this

2772
02:10:29,810 --> 02:10:29,219
I don't know

2773
02:10:32,149 --> 02:10:29,820
um

2774
02:10:34,310 --> 02:10:32,159
yeah Grant had them and I I have no

2775
02:10:36,109 --> 02:10:34,320
doubt that if Grant Grant's listening or

2776
02:10:38,209 --> 02:10:36,119
some other people like Melinda I might

2777
02:10:41,510 --> 02:10:38,219
feel terrible because Melinda wanted to

2778
02:10:43,970 --> 02:10:41,520
uh uh talk with me today I was so tired

2779
02:10:46,370 --> 02:10:43,980
I had to lie down before I did this with

2780
02:10:47,810 --> 02:10:46,380
you and now I feel bad because I think

2781
02:10:49,910 --> 02:10:47,820
she probably would have been very very

2782
02:10:52,609 --> 02:10:49,920
good for me to listen to

2783
02:10:54,109 --> 02:10:52,619
um if you know because I can't find any

2784
02:10:56,030 --> 02:10:54,119
reference to the arv in here by the way

2785
02:10:58,790 --> 02:10:56,040
I looked during that either I can't

2786
02:11:02,990 --> 02:10:58,800
either and and it was one of my Fondest

2787
02:11:04,729 --> 02:11:03,000
Memories uh of the last 24 hours all

2788
02:11:07,010 --> 02:11:04,739
right I don't know where it would be I

2789
02:11:08,689 --> 02:11:07,020
mean I've I've unless I'm just missing

2790
02:11:12,229 --> 02:11:08,699
something that's staring me right in the

2791
02:11:13,669 --> 02:11:12,239
face yeah but um no you're talking about

2792
02:11:15,530 --> 02:11:13,679
I you know I think they're the true

2793
02:11:18,229 --> 02:11:15,540
invisible College these people uh Eric

2794
02:11:20,870 --> 02:11:18,239
Davis helped off get green John

2795
02:11:22,609 --> 02:11:20,880
Alexander uh they're all part of it um

2796
02:11:24,890 --> 02:11:22,619
and then other people just they they

2797
02:11:27,290 --> 02:11:24,900
kind of uh come in and out of it I get

2798
02:11:28,910 --> 02:11:27,300
the idea you know Oak Shannon the people

2799
02:11:30,290 --> 02:11:28,920
with uh you know the advanced

2800
02:11:32,270 --> 02:11:30,300
theoretical physics group they're

2801
02:11:33,589 --> 02:11:32,280
they're kind of part of it

2802
02:11:36,709 --> 02:11:33,599
um but then the people around Robert

2803
02:11:37,970 --> 02:11:36,719
Bigelow certainly with the national with

2804
02:11:40,370 --> 02:11:37,980
nibs the National Institute for

2805
02:11:43,850 --> 02:11:40,380
Discovery Science in the 90s definitely

2806
02:11:44,810 --> 02:11:43,860
and then when that kind of went away

2807
02:11:46,669 --> 02:11:44,820
um

2808
02:11:49,430 --> 02:11:46,679
it continued a lot of the atip

2809
02:11:52,010 --> 02:11:49,440
contractors Dr putoff Eric Davis were

2810
02:11:53,450 --> 02:11:52,020
you know working for put up for uh atip

2811
02:11:55,010 --> 02:11:53,460
and

2812
02:11:57,290 --> 02:11:55,020
you know you really get the idea that

2813
02:11:58,669 --> 02:11:57,300
there was this informal Network that

2814
02:11:59,990 --> 02:11:58,679
just never went away

2815
02:12:02,089 --> 02:12:00,000
because they were old friends and they

2816
02:12:04,490 --> 02:12:02,099
respected each other they and they all

2817
02:12:05,990 --> 02:12:04,500
had their own security clearances and

2818
02:12:07,729 --> 02:12:06,000
and I think they were all smart enough

2819
02:12:09,830 --> 02:12:07,739
to know like

2820
02:12:11,810 --> 02:12:09,840
uh I think as Davis once put it in an

2821
02:12:13,250 --> 02:12:11,820
interview we gave uh they know the rules

2822
02:12:14,629 --> 02:12:13,260
of the road

2823
02:12:18,290 --> 02:12:14,639
so you

2824
02:12:19,669 --> 02:12:18,300
you know you just know

2825
02:12:20,870 --> 02:12:19,679
that there are certain things you don't

2826
02:12:22,930 --> 02:12:20,880
talk about but there's certain things

2827
02:12:26,149 --> 02:12:22,940
you can talk about what's what's safe

2828
02:12:26,930 --> 02:12:26,159
and they shared what was safe with each

2829
02:12:29,330 --> 02:12:26,940
other

2830
02:12:30,649 --> 02:12:29,340
so that they could all get they all

2831
02:12:32,750 --> 02:12:30,659
wanted to get to the goal line I think

2832
02:12:35,510 --> 02:12:32,760
the goal line is

2833
02:12:36,729 --> 02:12:35,520
it's very clear in my opinion these

2834
02:12:40,129 --> 02:12:36,739
these men

2835
02:12:42,530 --> 02:12:40,139
definitely were deeply are deeply

2836
02:12:44,629 --> 02:12:42,540
interested in the UFO ET phenomenon and

2837
02:12:45,830 --> 02:12:44,639
they want answers

2838
02:12:47,510 --> 02:12:45,840
and that's what they were just trying to

2839
02:12:49,490 --> 02:12:47,520
do like I don't know if this was a

2840
02:12:52,250 --> 02:12:49,500
professional interest or if they just

2841
02:12:55,270 --> 02:12:52,260
all share this fanatical need to know

2842
02:12:57,530 --> 02:12:55,280
like many of us have and

2843
02:13:00,350 --> 02:12:57,540
but I think a lot of it's just intense

2844
02:13:02,569 --> 02:13:00,360
curiosity and desire to know and there

2845
02:13:05,089 --> 02:13:02,579
was this need to know

2846
02:13:07,550 --> 02:13:05,099
um and what Admiral Wilson quickly found

2847
02:13:09,770 --> 02:13:07,560
out as deputy director of the defense

2848
02:13:12,290 --> 02:13:09,780
intelligence agency

2849
02:13:14,450 --> 02:13:12,300
um who handled budgets and and the money

2850
02:13:16,910 --> 02:13:14,460
coming out of Congress and the

2851
02:13:20,149 --> 02:13:16,920
appropriation of money going into these

2852
02:13:22,430 --> 02:13:20,159
sap programs that he thought he had the

2853
02:13:24,050 --> 02:13:22,440
authority to go and find out where the

2854
02:13:28,729 --> 02:13:24,060
money was going and what was being done

2855
02:13:32,109 --> 02:13:28,739
with it and he found out that as

2856
02:13:35,030 --> 02:13:32,119
secretive as saps are and they should be

2857
02:13:38,209 --> 02:13:35,040
that there was another level of secrecy

2858
02:13:42,970 --> 02:13:38,219
here above that that applied to aliens

2859
02:13:46,729 --> 02:13:42,980
and ET and UFOs that absolute secrecy

2860
02:13:50,629 --> 02:13:46,739
and then he found out about the bigot

2861
02:13:52,850 --> 02:13:50,639
list and he was not on it and and other

2862
02:13:54,649 --> 02:13:52,860
people that he thought should be on it

2863
02:13:58,669 --> 02:13:54,659
we're not there and there were were no

2864
02:14:00,709 --> 02:13:58,679
names there and he mentioned and uh he

2865
02:14:02,810 --> 02:14:00,719
recognized or I think one or two names I

2866
02:14:04,790 --> 02:14:02,820
think he may have recognized that and

2867
02:14:07,390 --> 02:14:04,800
none of it was military

2868
02:14:15,649 --> 02:14:11,930
that's right and he said 400 to 800

2869
02:14:19,010 --> 02:14:15,659
names on on this list

2870
02:14:21,470 --> 02:14:19,020
um and now let's go with what a bigot

2871
02:14:24,410 --> 02:14:21,480
list is and what big it is most people

2872
02:14:26,930 --> 02:14:24,420
want to assume this negative connotation

2873
02:14:29,629 --> 02:14:26,940
to it but that's that's not the origins

2874
02:14:32,510 --> 02:14:29,639
of the etymology of Big World War II

2875
02:14:34,430 --> 02:14:32,520
from the Second World War uh and it had

2876
02:14:36,470 --> 02:14:34,440
to do with the Brits British invasionary

2877
02:14:38,089 --> 02:14:36,480
ground

2878
02:14:40,430 --> 02:14:38,099
occupation I don't know something like

2879
02:14:42,470 --> 02:14:40,440
that had to do with uh the second world

2880
02:14:44,770 --> 02:14:42,480
war is where it began it was an acronym

2881
02:14:46,910 --> 02:14:44,780
doesn't mean bigot

2882
02:14:49,850 --> 02:14:46,920
but it has to do with like it's the

2883
02:14:51,350 --> 02:14:49,860
neces it's like the people who are in

2884
02:14:53,209 --> 02:14:51,360
who's in

2885
02:14:55,129 --> 02:14:53,219
are you in are you not in if you're in

2886
02:14:58,550 --> 02:14:55,139
you're on the list that's it's very

2887
02:15:00,530 --> 02:14:58,560
simple so Wilson in his uh statement to

2888
02:15:02,149 --> 02:15:00,540
Davis apparently said that he was shown

2889
02:15:03,290 --> 02:15:02,159
this list and he was allowed to look at

2890
02:15:08,030 --> 02:15:03,300
it

2891
02:15:10,310 --> 02:15:08,040
certain names were on and

2892
02:15:11,990 --> 02:15:10,320
and he asked for the criteria they said

2893
02:15:13,850 --> 02:15:12,000
no we're not we don't give you that and

2894
02:15:15,890 --> 02:15:13,860
he said well why why can't I be on it

2895
02:15:18,649 --> 02:15:15,900
and they wouldn't tell him that either

2896
02:15:21,410 --> 02:15:18,659
they wouldn't give him the criteria and

2897
02:15:25,910 --> 02:15:21,420
and to get on the list

2898
02:15:29,089 --> 02:15:25,920
um it is the ultimate level of trust to

2899
02:15:31,609 --> 02:15:29,099
get on that list you are not disclosing

2900
02:15:34,010 --> 02:15:31,619
what you're working on period I want to

2901
02:15:36,229 --> 02:15:34,020
mention something else here too uh this

2902
02:15:38,450 --> 02:15:36,239
that's it's a significant part of this

2903
02:15:41,390 --> 02:15:38,460
whole story which is an article written

2904
02:15:44,149 --> 02:15:41,400
by a man named Bill Sweetman for Jane's

2905
02:15:47,149 --> 02:15:44,159
uh defense James International defense

2906
02:15:49,550 --> 02:15:47,159
it's from January 2000.

2907
02:15:50,930 --> 02:15:49,560
and it is one of the only

2908
02:15:52,370 --> 02:15:50,940
articles that you're going to find

2909
02:15:55,010 --> 02:15:52,380
certainly from that period or really any

2910
02:15:56,990 --> 02:15:55,020
period where he tries to get into the

2911
02:15:59,209 --> 02:15:57,000
the Pentagon special access programs and

2912
02:16:01,370 --> 02:15:59,219
to talk about them so Bill Sweetman was

2913
02:16:03,530 --> 02:16:01,380
uh I don't know what he's doing now he

2914
02:16:06,050 --> 02:16:03,540
was a great Aviation writer I have a

2915
02:16:10,010 --> 02:16:06,060
couple of his old books uh of like

2916
02:16:11,629 --> 02:16:10,020
top-notch Aviation writer uh who

2917
02:16:13,810 --> 02:16:11,639
obviously knew the defense Community

2918
02:16:16,189 --> 02:16:13,820
exceedingly well and he did this article

2919
02:16:17,689 --> 02:16:16,199
called inside the pentagon's secret

2920
02:16:21,890 --> 02:16:17,699
budgets

2921
02:16:23,209 --> 02:16:21,900
now um where he talks about he says look

2922
02:16:26,209 --> 02:16:23,219
when you look at these special access

2923
02:16:28,069 --> 02:16:26,219
programs and in 2000 this is a kind of a

2924
02:16:29,510 --> 02:16:28,079
new thing for people to talk about

2925
02:16:30,290 --> 02:16:29,520
he said

2926
02:16:32,990 --> 02:16:30,300
um

2927
02:16:34,429 --> 02:16:33,000
it's not clear to me that the dod is

2928
02:16:37,490 --> 02:16:34,439
really the final word here it says it

2929
02:16:40,009 --> 02:16:37,500
seems to me that private contractors are

2930
02:16:41,389 --> 02:16:40,019
are on top and they run it and he said

2931
02:16:43,190 --> 02:16:41,399
also

2932
02:16:44,690 --> 02:16:43,200
uh if you're running if you're a program

2933
02:16:46,849 --> 02:16:44,700
manager for one of these programs

2934
02:16:50,270 --> 02:16:46,859
working for a private contractor

2935
02:16:52,549 --> 02:16:50,280
you decide who's in and who's out and

2936
02:16:54,349 --> 02:16:52,559
you know you you could leave a top level

2937
02:16:56,150 --> 02:16:54,359
general or top level person out if you

2938
02:16:58,370 --> 02:16:56,160
want to bring the friend you grew up

2939
02:17:00,650 --> 02:16:58,380
with who's not even in it then that

2940
02:17:03,530 --> 02:17:00,660
person's in and your classification

2941
02:17:06,889 --> 02:17:03,540
system he said could have nothing to do

2942
02:17:08,570 --> 02:17:06,899
with the formal Pentagon uh

2943
02:17:10,070 --> 02:17:08,580
classification systems this is what

2944
02:17:12,709 --> 02:17:10,080
Sweetman actually wrote in this article

2945
02:17:15,370 --> 02:17:12,719
and I'm mentioning this because I know

2946
02:17:18,110 --> 02:17:15,380
that that group

2947
02:17:20,330 --> 02:17:18,120
Mitchell and green and puttoff and Davis

2948
02:17:21,589 --> 02:17:20,340
they're all very very familiar with this

2949
02:17:23,870 --> 02:17:21,599
article

2950
02:17:26,509 --> 02:17:23,880
and it's a very a very significant

2951
02:17:28,490 --> 02:17:26,519
article for them and it's obvious

2952
02:17:29,929 --> 02:17:28,500
because that article

2953
02:17:32,990 --> 02:17:29,939
speaks

2954
02:17:34,910 --> 02:17:33,000
it's they feel it's very accurate now

2955
02:17:37,190 --> 02:17:34,920
what I would like to know and what I

2956
02:17:40,969 --> 02:17:37,200
don't know is did did any of those

2957
02:17:43,669 --> 02:17:40,979
people inform Bill Sweetman

2958
02:17:45,889 --> 02:17:43,679
of the whole Wilson Saga when he wrote

2959
02:17:48,589 --> 02:17:45,899
this this is what I wonder

2960
02:17:51,230 --> 02:17:48,599
I don't know the answer to that but I I

2961
02:17:53,509 --> 02:17:51,240
have wondered this more than one time

2962
02:17:56,209 --> 02:17:53,519
it's a really it's a good article it's a

2963
02:17:59,089 --> 02:17:56,219
great article actually and and and I

2964
02:18:03,049 --> 02:17:59,099
think to the other point here

2965
02:18:05,750 --> 02:18:03,059
um with uh a bigot list lacking military

2966
02:18:07,730 --> 02:18:05,760
and Military knowledge and any

2967
02:18:11,990 --> 02:18:07,740
conversation that would go back inside

2968
02:18:15,950 --> 02:18:12,000
of the Pentagon uh with a paper trail

2969
02:18:19,250 --> 02:18:15,960
of of any kind at all now you

2970
02:18:22,190 --> 02:18:19,260
um have uh uh accessed by the public and

2971
02:18:27,190 --> 02:18:22,200
Freedom of Information Act and as long

2972
02:18:29,570 --> 02:18:27,200
as this bigot list is uh you know 99

2973
02:18:31,490 --> 02:18:29,580
civilian there isn't going to be any

2974
02:18:33,230 --> 02:18:31,500
chatter going back to the Pentagon about

2975
02:18:35,270 --> 02:18:33,240
these programs

2976
02:18:38,150 --> 02:18:35,280
um and it's also in the civilian sector

2977
02:18:40,669 --> 02:18:38,160
right it's a private Corporation so you

2978
02:18:43,790 --> 02:18:40,679
don't have you don't have uh you know uh

2979
02:18:47,150 --> 02:18:43,800
document numbers and a way to chase back

2980
02:18:49,129 --> 02:18:47,160
a program because it is uh completely

2981
02:18:51,070 --> 02:18:49,139
private in in the private sector right

2982
02:18:54,410 --> 02:18:51,080
and that's why the bigot list would be

2983
02:18:57,110 --> 02:18:54,420
uh non-military yeah and moreover

2984
02:18:59,209 --> 02:18:57,120
exactly when when you uh when you read

2985
02:19:00,770 --> 02:18:59,219
through those notes Davis's notes thank

2986
02:19:04,070 --> 02:19:00,780
God he wrote that he wrote such good

2987
02:19:06,110 --> 02:19:04,080
notes I mean we'd like we would like for

2988
02:19:08,629 --> 02:19:06,120
it to have been even more but it's

2989
02:19:10,730 --> 02:19:08,639
amazing but what you get is this sense

2990
02:19:13,370 --> 02:19:10,740
that like how many individuals actually

2991
02:19:14,990 --> 02:19:13,380
are were minor monitoring these programs

2992
02:19:17,570 --> 02:19:15,000
how many individuals within the Pentagon

2993
02:19:19,790 --> 02:19:17,580
I mean within the the sapoc the special

2994
02:19:21,589 --> 02:19:19,800
Access program oversight committee and

2995
02:19:22,969 --> 02:19:21,599
and within that What's called the senior

2996
02:19:25,070 --> 02:19:22,979
review group all of those are referenced

2997
02:19:27,589 --> 02:19:25,080
in the notes how many people would have

2998
02:19:30,049 --> 02:19:27,599
access to what this contractor is doing

2999
02:19:32,389 --> 02:19:30,059
and how often would this contractor be

3000
02:19:34,129 --> 02:19:32,399
required to report on what they were

3001
02:19:36,650 --> 02:19:34,139
doing and who's who's actually doing the

3002
02:19:40,129 --> 02:19:36,660
review the impression that I came away

3003
02:19:42,169 --> 02:19:40,139
with is uh you know they do a once a

3004
02:19:43,429 --> 02:19:42,179
year review but like how deep are they

3005
02:19:46,129 --> 02:19:43,439
really going

3006
02:19:48,770 --> 02:19:46,139
it's not clear to me that you're getting

3007
02:19:50,510 --> 02:19:48,780
any significant oversight

3008
02:19:53,570 --> 02:19:50,520
and this is something that Sweetman

3009
02:19:55,010 --> 02:19:53,580
actually wrote in his article he said

3010
02:19:57,590 --> 02:19:55,020
it's not clear to me that there's really

3011
02:20:00,050 --> 02:19:57,600
any significant Pentagon oversight over

3012
02:20:01,730 --> 02:20:00,060
these programs no I really do Wonder

3013
02:20:05,270 --> 02:20:01,740
like his article comes out in January

3014
02:20:07,250 --> 02:20:05,280
2000 right so this was this whole thing

3015
02:20:10,610 --> 02:20:07,260
was bubbling around in very limited

3016
02:20:14,330 --> 02:20:10,620
circles and I just wonder if one of the

3017
02:20:16,610 --> 02:20:14,340
guys in in Robert Bigelow's click

3018
02:20:18,050 --> 02:20:16,620
uh I had a little conversation with Bill

3019
02:20:20,750 --> 02:20:18,060
Sweetman

3020
02:20:26,210 --> 02:20:20,760
and and and so here's the deal I mean

3021
02:20:28,670 --> 02:20:26,220
the oversight seems to stop at a general

3022
02:20:31,310 --> 02:20:28,680
number of budget

3023
02:20:33,110 --> 02:20:31,320
but what is being you know what's the

3024
02:20:35,870 --> 02:20:33,120
money being spent on what's the project

3025
02:20:39,170 --> 02:20:35,880
no there's no oversight there you don't

3026
02:20:40,929 --> 02:20:39,180
have it the the money is is sent to the

3027
02:20:44,750 --> 02:20:40,939
program and then what happens from there

3028
02:20:48,050 --> 02:20:44,760
uh nobody knows except for that private

3029
02:20:50,270 --> 02:20:48,060
Corporation and their employees that are

3030
02:20:51,889 --> 02:20:50,280
on that bigot list and that's it there

3031
02:20:54,849 --> 02:20:51,899
isn't and endearing a couple of people

3032
02:20:57,230 --> 02:20:54,859
in the Pentagon right

3033
02:20:59,929 --> 02:20:57,240
when they retire go to work for these

3034
02:21:02,630 --> 02:20:59,939
corporations and and and those members

3035
02:21:04,610 --> 02:21:02,640
of the Pentagon aren't necessarily in

3036
02:21:08,510 --> 02:21:04,620
the military either

3037
02:21:10,309 --> 02:21:08,520
right yeah I don't I don't know I mean

3038
02:21:11,990 --> 02:21:10,319
if if you're on the uh

3039
02:21:13,849 --> 02:21:12,000
well yeah that's right I mean uh that's

3040
02:21:16,309 --> 02:21:13,859
true you can have some very high level

3041
02:21:20,210 --> 02:21:16,319
civilian um people involved in that uh

3042
02:21:23,750 --> 02:21:20,220
100 100

3043
02:21:27,349 --> 02:21:23,760
um I um I want to run this by you

3044
02:21:29,510 --> 02:21:27,359
um and uh so check this out

3045
02:21:33,410 --> 02:21:29,520
this is about as interesting as it gets

3046
02:21:36,290 --> 02:21:33,420
uh two days ago I'm in a parking lot at

3047
02:21:38,630 --> 02:21:36,300
a at a shopping center and I'm putting

3048
02:21:41,630 --> 02:21:38,640
stuff in the back of my Jeep right this

3049
02:21:43,910 --> 02:21:41,640
guy comes up from him back of me and I

3050
02:21:47,690 --> 02:21:43,920
don't see him and he goes Fade to Black

3051
02:21:49,130 --> 02:21:47,700
right and I jump and I turn around and

3052
02:21:53,090 --> 02:21:49,140
he goes bad it's good to meet you I said

3053
02:21:54,830 --> 02:21:53,100
oh okay uh uh what's going on and we

3054
02:21:58,210 --> 02:21:54,840
stopped and talked and he said that he

3055
02:22:01,670 --> 02:21:58,220
was uh born and raised here in Palmdale

3056
02:22:06,889 --> 02:22:01,680
and he said let me tell you something

3057
02:22:12,889 --> 02:22:08,750
in the 90s

3058
02:22:16,370 --> 02:22:14,090
craft

3059
02:22:19,790 --> 02:22:16,380
being flight tested here

3060
02:22:23,090 --> 02:22:19,800
I said hexagon you mean trying no

3061
02:22:26,270 --> 02:22:23,100
he goes like stop signs hexagon

3062
02:22:29,809 --> 02:22:26,280
I go what do you mean dude day and night

3063
02:22:33,110 --> 02:22:29,819
and I said what what were they they said

3064
02:22:36,830 --> 02:22:33,120
totally silent we all watched them

3065
02:22:40,910 --> 02:22:36,840
in the 90s and they were black and I

3066
02:22:45,050 --> 02:22:40,920
said he said what's that in Palmdale in

3067
02:22:46,670 --> 02:22:45,060
Palmdale and uh so you know Skunk Works

3068
02:22:50,870 --> 02:22:46,680
is is here it's in the center of town

3069
02:22:53,270 --> 02:22:50,880
and um uh so anyway he's I said how big

3070
02:22:54,650 --> 02:22:53,280
were they and he's standing next to me

3071
02:22:58,790 --> 02:22:54,660
and he goes from here to the building

3072
02:23:01,490 --> 02:22:58,800
and that was about 50 yards 35 40 50

3073
02:23:06,110 --> 02:23:01,500
yards away and I'm like I'm like what he

3074
02:23:07,370 --> 02:23:06,120
goes thick hexagon black Silent Flight

3075
02:23:11,170 --> 02:23:07,380
testing

3076
02:23:15,050 --> 02:23:11,180
in the 90s I was like thou I have never

3077
02:23:19,910 --> 02:23:15,060
heard anything like that hexagon not

3078
02:23:22,070 --> 02:23:19,920
triangle not anything but hexagon shape

3079
02:23:24,650 --> 02:23:22,080
um and but here's the deal this goes

3080
02:23:27,110 --> 02:23:24,660
back to that bigot list

3081
02:23:31,190 --> 02:23:27,120
nobody's ever talked about this

3082
02:23:33,110 --> 02:23:31,200
you know and uh sightings in Palmdale uh

3083
02:23:34,670 --> 02:23:33,120
if it was going on people are used to

3084
02:23:36,670 --> 02:23:34,680
flight testing out here things are

3085
02:23:41,750 --> 02:23:36,680
getting tested everybody that lives here

3086
02:23:43,130 --> 02:23:41,760
works right down the street at uh and

3087
02:23:45,110 --> 02:23:43,140
they're not going to be talking about

3088
02:23:47,150 --> 02:23:45,120
this and they may be familiar with it

3089
02:23:49,490 --> 02:23:47,160
but it goes back to that bigot list if

3090
02:23:51,889 --> 02:23:49,500
you if you're in one of these programs

3091
02:23:55,730 --> 02:23:51,899
you're just simply not talking about it

3092
02:23:57,650 --> 02:23:55,740
and uh to get that reveal from him uh

3093
02:24:01,730 --> 02:23:57,660
now I immediately talked about it on the

3094
02:24:04,190 --> 02:24:01,740
air uh yesterday but I thought it was uh

3095
02:24:05,929 --> 02:24:04,200
for me a pretty big uh Revelation I have

3096
02:24:09,230 --> 02:24:05,939
never heard anything described I think

3097
02:24:11,870 --> 02:24:09,240
that's very interesting yeah the

3098
02:24:15,770 --> 02:24:11,880
question is like how how much how much

3099
02:24:17,750 --> 02:24:15,780
UFO activity is stuff that we are making

3100
02:24:19,490 --> 02:24:17,760
and how much of it isn't

3101
02:24:21,889 --> 02:24:19,500
I've been wondering about this a lot

3102
02:24:24,650 --> 02:24:21,899
this is gets us off off the Davis Wilson

3103
02:24:27,230 --> 02:24:24,660
for a moment but I'll just say I've been

3104
02:24:29,210 --> 02:24:27,240
trying to figure this out or does it or

3105
02:24:30,170 --> 02:24:29,220
no but or does it take us off Wilson

3106
02:24:31,910 --> 02:24:30,180
Davis

3107
02:24:33,410 --> 02:24:31,920
because necessarily I mean we're talking

3108
02:24:36,889 --> 02:24:33,420
about reverse engineering possibilities

3109
02:24:41,090 --> 02:24:36,899
engineering yes exactly

3110
02:24:43,910 --> 02:24:41,100
um but what I what I see I mean I I look

3111
02:24:45,469 --> 02:24:43,920
at UFO uh reports all the time these

3112
02:24:47,929 --> 02:24:45,479
days I mean I'm

3113
02:24:50,270 --> 02:24:47,939
I'm just going into all of them over the

3114
02:24:52,670 --> 02:24:50,280
years and I mean we're just talking such

3115
02:24:56,330 --> 02:24:52,680
an enormous number of

3116
02:24:58,010 --> 02:24:56,340
very compelling obviously real sightings

3117
02:25:00,110 --> 02:24:58,020
of anomalous craft that happen

3118
02:25:01,130 --> 02:25:00,120
essentially every single day around the

3119
02:25:03,170 --> 02:25:01,140
world

3120
02:25:05,570 --> 02:25:03,180
there's so many of these we're talking

3121
02:25:08,510 --> 02:25:05,580
thousands of good sightings every year

3122
02:25:11,090 --> 02:25:08,520
my own personal estimate thought about

3123
02:25:13,370 --> 02:25:11,100
this a lot I think worldwide most likely

3124
02:25:15,889 --> 02:25:13,380
we're probably looking at anywhere from

3125
02:25:18,050 --> 02:25:15,899
50 to 100 000 good UFO sightings around

3126
02:25:21,170 --> 02:25:18,060
the world every year and it may sound

3127
02:25:23,630 --> 02:25:21,180
crazy but it isn't uh in North America

3128
02:25:26,870 --> 02:25:23,640
alone where it's the only continent

3129
02:25:29,030 --> 02:25:26,880
where we really have good reporting

3130
02:25:30,230 --> 02:25:29,040
of raw reports that people can you know

3131
02:25:32,330 --> 02:25:30,240
you got muffon and you've got the

3132
02:25:33,710 --> 02:25:32,340
National UFO Reporting Center those two

3133
02:25:34,730 --> 02:25:33,720
combined every year have 10 000

3134
02:25:37,010 --> 02:25:34,740
sightings

3135
02:25:38,630 --> 02:25:37,020
now I mean obviously I'm not saying

3136
02:25:41,030 --> 02:25:38,640
they're all alien craft most of them

3137
02:25:42,590 --> 02:25:41,040
clearly are not but you go through them

3138
02:25:45,110 --> 02:25:42,600
I've I've read through a lot of these

3139
02:25:46,190 --> 02:25:45,120
reports and I'll I'll just say many of

3140
02:25:48,170 --> 02:25:46,200
them are going to make you sit back and

3141
02:25:50,990 --> 02:25:48,180
say wow there's some very good reports

3142
02:25:53,150 --> 02:25:51,000
there and then for every report that

3143
02:25:55,610 --> 02:25:53,160
makes it to a database how many are seen

3144
02:25:57,290 --> 02:25:55,620
and they're never reported there's a lot

3145
02:25:59,090 --> 02:25:57,300
of these so and that's only North

3146
02:26:01,070 --> 02:25:59,100
America which only has five percent of

3147
02:26:03,410 --> 02:26:01,080
the world's population U.S and Canada

3148
02:26:05,870 --> 02:26:03,420
I'm leaving up Mexico here and then you

3149
02:26:08,389 --> 02:26:05,880
go to South America the Latin American

3150
02:26:11,410 --> 02:26:08,399
nations you go to Europe you go to

3151
02:26:15,110 --> 02:26:11,420
Russia you go to China you go to Africa

3152
02:26:17,270 --> 02:26:15,120
Indonesia good Lord how many you know we

3153
02:26:19,929 --> 02:26:17,280
only get some of those reports so here's

3154
02:26:23,150 --> 02:26:19,939
my point my point is that this is a

3155
02:26:26,090 --> 02:26:23,160
massive phenomenon

3156
02:26:28,130 --> 02:26:26,100
and and one of my most the Intriguing

3157
02:26:30,770 --> 02:26:28,140
sightings that I cannot stop studying

3158
02:26:32,929 --> 02:26:30,780
are the cases and these happen all the

3159
02:26:34,070 --> 02:26:32,939
time someone will be up at three in the

3160
02:26:35,929 --> 02:26:34,080
morning and they will see a black

3161
02:26:37,910 --> 02:26:35,939
triangle hovering at 200 feet over their

3162
02:26:39,530 --> 02:26:37,920
house or over their neighbor's house at

3163
02:26:41,809 --> 02:26:39,540
three in the morning and they almost

3164
02:26:44,270 --> 02:26:41,819
didn't see it because it was so dark and

3165
02:26:46,429 --> 02:26:44,280
so stealthy and silent but there it was

3166
02:26:48,770 --> 02:26:46,439
and not always triangles

3167
02:26:50,270 --> 02:26:48,780
now these are military operations you've

3168
02:26:52,969 --> 02:26:50,280
got to ask yourself what the hell are

3169
02:26:54,349 --> 02:26:52,979
they doing at 200 300 feet altitude at

3170
02:26:58,250 --> 02:26:54,359
two in the morning over you over your

3171
02:26:59,510 --> 02:26:58,260
house why around the world

3172
02:27:01,790 --> 02:26:59,520
I don't think that these are all

3173
02:27:03,830 --> 02:27:01,800
military black budget they can't be it's

3174
02:27:07,190 --> 02:27:03,840
too many of them I think there's just

3175
02:27:10,849 --> 02:27:07,200
too many I do think that we have a uh

3176
02:27:12,170 --> 02:27:10,859
let's say domestic Fleet sure now what

3177
02:27:14,690 --> 02:27:12,180
they're being used for what their

3178
02:27:16,550 --> 02:27:14,700
mission is this is important to inquire

3179
02:27:18,650 --> 02:27:16,560
because they're not being used in

3180
02:27:21,170 --> 02:27:18,660
standard geopolitics

3181
02:27:25,490 --> 02:27:21,180
so what are they being used for and

3182
02:27:28,550 --> 02:27:25,500
who's who controls their operation

3183
02:27:30,830 --> 02:27:28,560
but uh anyway my point is that a lot of

3184
02:27:34,670 --> 02:27:30,840
these are they're not ours

3185
02:27:36,730 --> 02:27:34,680
I had um but most are not I think uh

3186
02:27:40,070 --> 02:27:36,740
somebody uh it was a neighbor

3187
02:27:42,170 --> 02:27:40,080
uh outside of the convenience outside of

3188
02:27:43,910 --> 02:27:42,180
the community right no one knows what I

3189
02:27:45,889 --> 02:27:43,920
do and he came up to me his name was

3190
02:27:48,110 --> 02:27:45,899
Mikey I've known him since he was a

3191
02:27:50,870 --> 02:27:48,120
little kid and he goes man you know so

3192
02:27:53,030 --> 02:27:50,880
uh you know I'm I'm I'm out of my dad's

3193
02:27:56,330 --> 02:27:53,040
house in Palmdale this is uh over in

3194
02:27:58,309 --> 02:27:56,340
Burbank and he that's exactly what he

3195
02:28:00,790 --> 02:27:58,319
describes to me he said the human

3196
02:28:04,130 --> 02:28:00,800
outside at three o'clock in the morning

3197
02:28:07,010 --> 02:28:04,140
and above the house out here in Palmdale

3198
02:28:09,950 --> 02:28:07,020
he said it was like Star Wars a big

3199
02:28:12,230 --> 02:28:09,960
black triangle over the house and now

3200
02:28:14,809 --> 02:28:12,240
this is out of this is not somebody that

3201
02:28:16,510 --> 02:28:14,819
is you know following fade the black or

3202
02:28:23,330 --> 02:28:16,520
you know

3203
02:28:26,150 --> 02:28:23,340
has no it's not who he is and he said

3204
02:28:28,730 --> 02:28:26,160
check this out Richard he goes I freaked

3205
02:28:30,770 --> 02:28:28,740
out I know that Edwards Air Force Base

3206
02:28:33,410 --> 02:28:30,780
is right over there and I'm wondering

3207
02:28:36,050 --> 02:28:33,420
where's the military and why aren't we

3208
02:28:39,050 --> 02:28:36,060
shooting at this thing that was his

3209
02:28:42,110 --> 02:28:39,060
comment right and oh by the way

3210
02:28:44,210 --> 02:28:42,120
he said it just raised straight up and

3211
02:28:46,130 --> 02:28:44,220
kept going and it was black and that

3212
02:28:48,950 --> 02:28:46,140
just disappeared

3213
02:28:51,290 --> 02:28:48,960
yep and he said for years he couldn't

3214
02:28:54,410 --> 02:28:51,300
walk outside at night

3215
02:28:56,809 --> 02:28:54,420
yep yep I'm so glad you mentioned that

3216
02:29:00,110 --> 02:28:56,819
story because there's many of those that

3217
02:29:01,849 --> 02:29:00,120
is that is almost I've seen so many of

3218
02:29:04,010 --> 02:29:01,859
them that it's almost a cliche it's not

3219
02:29:06,050 --> 02:29:04,020
a cliche but it's a it's a classic type

3220
02:29:07,670 --> 02:29:06,060
of sighting and it's a widespread type

3221
02:29:08,750 --> 02:29:07,680
of signing and it's something no one

3222
02:29:10,550 --> 02:29:08,760
talks about

3223
02:29:12,590 --> 02:29:10,560
I don't hear anyone in the UFO Community

3224
02:29:15,349 --> 02:29:12,600
talking about it to me I'm I get worked

3225
02:29:16,790 --> 02:29:15,359
up over this because I feel this is a

3226
02:29:20,210 --> 02:29:16,800
significant thing

3227
02:29:21,770 --> 02:29:20,220
imagine uh one thing I tried to do when

3228
02:29:23,990 --> 02:29:21,780
I was reading enough of these I thought

3229
02:29:26,690 --> 02:29:24,000
I got into Google Earth and I put myself

3230
02:29:28,010 --> 02:29:26,700
down at 300 feet altitude over the

3231
02:29:30,590 --> 02:29:28,020
neighborhood where this one particular

3232
02:29:33,950 --> 02:29:30,600
sighting was reported

3233
02:29:36,050 --> 02:29:33,960
and I just slowly went over the houses

3234
02:29:37,969 --> 02:29:36,060
at that altitude and I thought what

3235
02:29:39,650 --> 02:29:37,979
would what would I be doing at three in

3236
02:29:41,210 --> 02:29:39,660
the morning over these houses

3237
02:29:42,590 --> 02:29:41,220
yeah what's the purpose there's only a

3238
02:29:44,809 --> 02:29:42,600
couple of things I could think of

3239
02:29:46,309 --> 02:29:44,819
abducting people comes to mind

3240
02:29:49,490 --> 02:29:46,319
immediately

3241
02:29:50,750 --> 02:29:49,500
or engaging in maybe psychotronic stuff

3242
02:29:52,730 --> 02:29:50,760
if you really want to like mess with

3243
02:29:54,530 --> 02:29:52,740
people or maybe get in their head you

3244
02:29:56,210 --> 02:29:54,540
have people talking about these Ultra

3245
02:29:58,070 --> 02:29:56,220
vivid dreams is

3246
02:30:00,710 --> 02:29:58,080
is that what's happening I don't really

3247
02:30:03,650 --> 02:30:00,720
know but but it's certainly something

3248
02:30:05,570 --> 02:30:03,660
that we want to know about I would sure

3249
02:30:08,750 --> 02:30:05,580
as hell like to know if there was a

3250
02:30:10,670 --> 02:30:08,760
craft over my house uh tonight

3251
02:30:13,130 --> 02:30:10,680
at 200 feet at three in the morning I'd

3252
02:30:15,110 --> 02:30:13,140
like to know what that is

3253
02:30:17,630 --> 02:30:15,120
there are many of these that are

3254
02:30:18,889 --> 02:30:17,640
reported and it's very disturbing I'm

3255
02:30:21,230 --> 02:30:18,899
getting us a little off track I

3256
02:30:23,809 --> 02:30:21,240
Apologize no you're not well it's not an

3257
02:30:26,450 --> 02:30:23,819
important thing this guy the other day

3258
02:30:28,790 --> 02:30:26,460
in the parking lot he said at night in

3259
02:30:30,590 --> 02:30:28,800
Palmdale it's just jumping off I said

3260
02:30:33,650 --> 02:30:30,600
yeah it is he goes man it's just

3261
02:30:37,070 --> 02:30:33,660
incredible he said but the hexagons

3262
02:30:41,510 --> 02:30:37,080
stopped it was only in the 90s

3263
02:30:44,809 --> 02:30:41,520
that's it and uh yeah yeah yeah yeah and

3264
02:30:46,969 --> 02:30:44,819
he was so specific about it and just so

3265
02:30:49,010 --> 02:30:46,979
excited uh to tell me this but he said

3266
02:30:52,130 --> 02:30:49,020
you know this is what what goes on out

3267
02:30:54,110 --> 02:30:52,140
here I have not

3268
02:30:56,570 --> 02:30:54,120
um I'm not even sure if I would tell

3269
02:30:58,490 --> 02:30:56,580
anybody if I did see anything because I

3270
02:31:00,950 --> 02:30:58,500
live here if I say something and it's

3271
02:31:02,929 --> 02:31:00,960
something that's being tested am I

3272
02:31:05,510 --> 02:31:02,939
disclosing government secrets on the air

3273
02:31:08,809 --> 02:31:05,520
in real time right am I going to get the

3274
02:31:12,710 --> 02:31:08,819
real bona fide Men In Black visit you

3275
02:31:15,230 --> 02:31:12,720
know I have to think some of these could

3276
02:31:16,610 --> 02:31:15,240
very well be test vehicles

3277
02:31:18,469 --> 02:31:16,620
yeah

3278
02:31:19,969 --> 02:31:18,479
but the thing is there's there's a lot

3279
02:31:22,610 --> 02:31:19,979
of these reports out there that's the

3280
02:31:24,469 --> 02:31:22,620
thing there's so many of them and

3281
02:31:26,630 --> 02:31:24,479
they're not all in Palmdale like a lot

3282
02:31:28,490 --> 02:31:26,640
of them are out in you know Kia Cook

3283
02:31:30,710 --> 02:31:28,500
Iowa or you know out in the middle of

3284
02:31:32,270 --> 02:31:30,720
other or other countries

3285
02:31:36,110 --> 02:31:32,280
they're not they're not even all in the

3286
02:31:40,849 --> 02:31:37,730
um uh can I keep you for another 20

3287
02:31:43,190 --> 02:31:40,859
minutes are you okay okay good

3288
02:31:44,990 --> 02:31:43,200
um the other thing that keeps getting

3289
02:31:46,670 --> 02:31:45,000
repeated and I think this is from

3290
02:31:49,550 --> 02:31:46,680
outside of our community it's not

3291
02:31:51,410 --> 02:31:49,560
necessarily uh you know somebody that's

3292
02:31:53,330 --> 02:31:51,420
research but they all say the same thing

3293
02:31:55,429 --> 02:31:53,340
silent

3294
02:31:58,969 --> 02:31:55,439
right they don't talk about noise or

3295
02:32:00,889 --> 02:31:58,979
engine noise or or hums or no it's

3296
02:32:03,469 --> 02:32:00,899
always sometimes it's even more than

3297
02:32:05,389 --> 02:32:03,479
silent I've read I've read reports where

3298
02:32:08,510 --> 02:32:05,399
someone will say it's like all all the

3299
02:32:10,370 --> 02:32:08,520
noise got sucked out it was like the

3300
02:32:13,849 --> 02:32:10,380
deadest of dead silence you can imagine

3301
02:32:15,710 --> 02:32:13,859
yeah fascinating let's take our break

3302
02:32:17,270 --> 02:32:15,720
we're going into overtime with Richard

3303
02:32:19,190 --> 02:32:17,280
bleep and Dolan what a great

3304
02:32:20,870 --> 02:32:19,200
conversation tonight there's a lot of

3305
02:32:23,210 --> 02:32:20,880
follow-up stuff that I want to get to

3306
02:32:25,490 --> 02:32:23,220
next this is Fade to Black I'm your host

3307
02:32:28,309 --> 02:32:25,500
Jimmy Church stay with us

3308
02:32:33,710 --> 02:32:28,319
we'll be right back this is night three

3309
02:32:50,030 --> 02:32:48,740
[Music]

3310
02:32:58,010 --> 02:32:50,040
[Applause]

3311
02:33:08,050 --> 02:33:00,469
you're listening to Chevy church and

3312
02:33:12,950 --> 02:33:10,190
here and you are listening to listen to

3313
02:33:18,770 --> 02:33:12,960
my boy Jimmy Church on jimmychurch

3314
02:33:18,780 --> 02:33:23,150
reading a book will not make you smarter

3315
02:33:26,330 --> 02:33:24,650
you've been listening to Jimmy church

3316
02:33:28,550 --> 02:33:26,340
will

3317
02:33:31,790 --> 02:33:28,560
hello fadernauts Jimmy church here

3318
02:33:34,130 --> 02:33:31,800
you've seen me with my thunderstorm now

3319
02:33:36,410 --> 02:33:34,140
you can purify the air in your home and

3320
02:33:38,630 --> 02:33:36,420
get healthy clean fresh smelling air and

3321
02:33:40,550 --> 02:33:38,640
eliminate odors just like I do right

3322
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here in the bunker the Eden Pier

3323
02:33:45,590 --> 02:33:43,260
thunderstorm uses oxy technology that

3324
02:33:47,990 --> 02:33:45,600
naturally sends out O3 molecules into

3325
02:33:50,150 --> 02:33:48,000
the air which seek out odors and air

3326
02:33:52,550 --> 02:33:50,160
pollutants in your home and destroys

3327
02:33:55,429 --> 02:33:52,560
them it's called a thunderstorm because

3328
02:33:57,770 --> 02:33:55,439
it purifies the air just like after a

3329
02:34:00,590 --> 02:33:57,780
thunderstorm and right now you can save

3330
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3333
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3334
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go to edenpuredeals.com and use fader3

3335
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shipping is free and it's easy just

3336
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scroll down you'll see my name right

3337
02:34:26,450 --> 02:34:22,979
there Jimmy Church click on it and get

3338
02:34:29,110 --> 02:34:26,460
your deal today that's Eden peer deals

3339
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3340
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3341
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3342
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3357
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3362
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3363
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3364
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3365
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3366
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3367
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3381
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3382
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3390
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3391
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3392
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3400
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3401
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3403
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3404
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3405
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[Music]

3406
02:37:52,309 --> 02:37:49,800
Church overtime with Richard bleeping

3407
02:37:54,290 --> 02:37:52,319
Dolan what a great conversation tonight

3408
02:37:56,450 --> 02:37:54,300
it's always great when Richard is on the

3409
02:37:59,389 --> 02:37:56,460
show we're talking about Wilson Davis

3410
02:38:02,090 --> 02:37:59,399
bombshell night three here on Fade to

3411
02:38:04,370 --> 02:38:02,100
Black and Richard now

3412
02:38:06,590 --> 02:38:04,380
um uh I need to I need to pick your

3413
02:38:08,990 --> 02:38:06,600
brain about a couple of things and

3414
02:38:11,090 --> 02:38:09,000
specifically

3415
02:38:12,770 --> 02:38:11,100
um who is on the need to know we talked

3416
02:38:15,110 --> 02:38:12,780
about the bigot list and and

3417
02:38:16,969 --> 02:38:15,120
specifically

3418
02:38:18,410 --> 02:38:16,979
um Thomas Wilson said no politicians

3419
02:38:21,230 --> 02:38:18,420
were on that list

3420
02:38:23,510 --> 02:38:21,240
and that's interesting and we just went

3421
02:38:27,410 --> 02:38:23,520
through this UFO hearing

3422
02:38:29,929 --> 02:38:27,420
um uh uh with uh the subcommittee

3423
02:38:33,590 --> 02:38:29,939
um and there was that and then we go

3424
02:38:36,050 --> 02:38:33,600
back to the Oak Shannon notes and almost

3425
02:38:38,330 --> 02:38:36,060
on on one of the last pages I'm going to

3426
02:38:41,809 --> 02:38:38,340
pull it up here

3427
02:38:45,110 --> 02:38:41,819
um is this the plan with the government

3428
02:38:48,230 --> 02:38:45,120
right and it's right there and then it

3429
02:38:51,170 --> 02:38:48,240
says here get Authority and it says no

3430
02:38:54,650 --> 02:38:51,180
no no no no it says no to the president

3431
02:38:57,770 --> 02:38:54,660
no to the vice president right and so

3432
02:38:59,809 --> 02:38:57,780
that would indicate to me

3433
02:39:02,450 --> 02:38:59,819
um in this conversation that the

3434
02:39:04,429 --> 02:39:02,460
President and Vice President they would

3435
02:39:08,389 --> 02:39:04,439
know what's going on

3436
02:39:11,630 --> 02:39:08,399
um Thomas Wilson says uh that this is

3437
02:39:14,510 --> 02:39:11,640
above the most secret things that he has

3438
02:39:16,730 --> 02:39:14,520
ever known about that this is uh on a

3439
02:39:19,370 --> 02:39:16,740
whole nother level of secrecy that he

3440
02:39:22,190 --> 02:39:19,380
had known nothing about uh prior to this

3441
02:39:24,110 --> 02:39:22,200
and then we're in the middle of these

3442
02:39:27,650 --> 02:39:24,120
hearings

3443
02:39:29,950 --> 02:39:27,660
um and and what is uh being attempted to

3444
02:39:33,469 --> 02:39:29,960
from politicians going what's going on

3445
02:39:36,469 --> 02:39:33,479
uh what's going on with this UFO thing

3446
02:39:38,929 --> 02:39:36,479
being stonewalled Stonewall by uh the

3447
02:39:41,750 --> 02:39:38,939
Navy and the Air Force and in the

3448
02:39:43,670 --> 02:39:41,760
agencies and that would indicate to me

3449
02:39:45,290 --> 02:39:43,680
that that is exactly what's going on

3450
02:39:48,830 --> 02:39:45,300
here we go back to that bigot list

3451
02:39:52,190 --> 02:39:48,840
they're not talking right there is no

3452
02:39:55,910 --> 02:39:52,200
there isn't a anywhere to go here and if

3453
02:39:57,730 --> 02:39:55,920
we look at the last five years what has

3454
02:40:01,910 --> 02:39:57,740
actually been

3455
02:40:05,030 --> 02:40:01,920
revealed to us outside of uh there was

3456
02:40:06,730 --> 02:40:05,040
an atip program at at one point but

3457
02:40:09,650 --> 02:40:06,740
other than that

3458
02:40:12,650 --> 02:40:09,660
these Revelations that have gone on this

3459
02:40:14,809 --> 02:40:12,660
week from the UFO Community with Admiral

3460
02:40:17,090 --> 02:40:14,819
Wilson and Oak Shannon in these notes

3461
02:40:19,550 --> 02:40:17,100
that's more than anything that has been

3462
02:40:20,410 --> 02:40:19,560
revealed in the last five years yeah

3463
02:40:22,790 --> 02:40:20,420
yeah

3464
02:40:24,770 --> 02:40:22,800
uh I'm looking over these notes as well

3465
02:40:27,290 --> 02:40:24,780
and uh they're actually just fascinating

3466
02:40:29,870 --> 02:40:27,300
notes there's a lot in here for analysis

3467
02:40:32,030 --> 02:40:29,880
and research and I I feel like I failed

3468
02:40:34,010 --> 02:40:32,040
in uh I'm not really studying them

3469
02:40:37,370 --> 02:40:34,020
sufficiently before we went on tonight I

3470
02:40:38,870 --> 02:40:37,380
apologize to the listeners into you

3471
02:40:43,010 --> 02:40:38,880
um but I just was not aware of them

3472
02:40:43,910 --> 02:40:43,020
until today so that's the the fact of it

3473
02:40:46,730 --> 02:40:43,920
um

3474
02:40:48,110 --> 02:40:46,740
yes and and I just want to go I just

3475
02:40:49,250 --> 02:40:48,120
want to devour them and read them very

3476
02:40:51,590 --> 02:40:49,260
carefully now

3477
02:40:52,969 --> 02:40:51,600
what you're saying though about uh the

3478
02:40:55,610 --> 02:40:52,979
president being all you know not

3479
02:40:58,309 --> 02:40:55,620
involved it's not clear to me that these

3480
02:41:00,050 --> 02:40:58,319
these men at at that time in the 1980s

3481
02:41:01,370 --> 02:41:00,060
would absolutely have certain knowledge

3482
02:41:03,410 --> 02:41:01,380
of this

3483
02:41:07,010 --> 02:41:03,420
so that's one thing I would say but I

3484
02:41:11,090 --> 02:41:09,349
um this has definitely been made

3485
02:41:12,770 --> 02:41:11,100
I have definitely been made to

3486
02:41:16,130 --> 02:41:12,780
understand

3487
02:41:16,910 --> 02:41:16,140
by more than one of those individuals in

3488
02:41:20,630 --> 02:41:16,920
that

3489
02:41:23,330 --> 02:41:20,640
um

3490
02:41:25,429 --> 02:41:23,340
the U.S president for example is I mean

3491
02:41:28,730 --> 02:41:25,439
we cannot all figure this out but that

3492
02:41:31,130 --> 02:41:28,740
the US president is not often the you

3493
02:41:33,530 --> 02:41:31,140
know even in the loop on this uh as was

3494
02:41:35,210 --> 02:41:33,540
told to me by one of the um gentlemen

3495
02:41:37,429 --> 02:41:35,220
very closely connected to all of this he

3496
02:41:38,870 --> 02:41:37,439
said look president's come and go he

3497
02:41:41,870 --> 02:41:38,880
said the the people running these

3498
02:41:44,570 --> 02:41:41,880
programs are lifers and the fact is not

3499
02:41:47,750 --> 02:41:44,580
all presidents are reliable

3500
02:41:49,849 --> 02:41:47,760
they they cannot all be trusted was

3501
02:41:53,030 --> 02:41:49,859
actually what I was told

3502
02:41:57,650 --> 02:41:56,270
uh one one gentleman told me and he said

3503
02:41:59,870 --> 02:41:57,660
that in his retirement he had

3504
02:42:04,250 --> 02:41:59,880
conversations with uh I think he said it

3505
02:42:06,110 --> 02:42:04,260
was 18. former uh retired government

3506
02:42:08,389 --> 02:42:06,120
people who were either former U.S

3507
02:42:10,670 --> 02:42:08,399
presidents former secretaries of defense

3508
02:42:14,210 --> 02:42:10,680
or under secretaries of defense or head

3509
02:42:16,070 --> 02:42:14,220
of CIA so 18 of those people

3510
02:42:20,030 --> 02:42:16,080
and this gentleman had had conversations

3511
02:42:21,290 --> 02:42:20,040
with him he knew them uh about E.T slash

3512
02:42:22,790 --> 02:42:21,300
UFOs

3513
02:42:25,190 --> 02:42:22,800
could you imagine

3514
02:42:28,309 --> 02:42:25,200
having conversations with 18 of those

3515
02:42:31,190 --> 02:42:28,319
individuals about UFOs and E.T well this

3516
02:42:34,010 --> 02:42:31,200
man told me this is years ago that he

3517
02:42:37,429 --> 02:42:34,020
did and he said their reactions their

3518
02:42:38,809 --> 02:42:37,439
responses broke down into three basic

3519
02:42:42,410 --> 02:42:38,819
types

3520
02:42:44,510 --> 02:42:42,420
he said the the largest group

3521
02:42:45,590 --> 02:42:44,520
maybe I'm trying to remember how many he

3522
02:42:47,570 --> 02:42:45,600
said maybe

3523
02:42:49,790 --> 02:42:47,580
um maybe close to half of them

3524
02:42:52,070 --> 02:42:49,800
said UFOs what are you wasting your time

3525
02:42:53,929 --> 02:42:52,080
with that nonsense that's stupid

3526
02:42:55,790 --> 02:42:53,939
I don't I don't want to even get into

3527
02:42:56,870 --> 02:42:55,800
that he said

3528
02:43:00,650 --> 02:42:56,880
um

3529
02:43:03,590 --> 02:43:00,660
another about equally large group

3530
02:43:05,450 --> 02:43:03,600
said oh I'm fascinated by this what do

3531
02:43:09,170 --> 02:43:05,460
you know maybe we can share information

3532
02:43:11,929 --> 02:43:09,180
I'd like to know what whatever you know

3533
02:43:14,210 --> 02:43:11,939
and um

3534
02:43:17,389 --> 02:43:14,220
it was uh

3535
02:43:19,670 --> 02:43:17,399
it was like two or three he said

3536
02:43:22,490 --> 02:43:19,680
actually really knew

3537
02:43:25,250 --> 02:43:22,500
anything like had been formally briefed

3538
02:43:28,070 --> 02:43:25,260
at a high level and actually were in the

3539
02:43:29,150 --> 02:43:28,080
know that was what he said to me

3540
02:43:30,950 --> 02:43:29,160
um

3541
02:43:32,110 --> 02:43:30,960
and so if that's the case you know

3542
02:43:35,150 --> 02:43:32,120
you're taking

3543
02:43:37,190 --> 02:43:35,160
I mean president secretary of defense

3544
02:43:38,710 --> 02:43:37,200
under Secretary of Defense and CIA

3545
02:43:41,330 --> 02:43:38,720
director that's you're at the Pinnacle

3546
02:43:43,730 --> 02:43:41,340
of the National Security apparatus there

3547
02:43:46,429 --> 02:43:43,740
you're at the highest the peak of the

3548
02:43:48,050 --> 02:43:46,439
summit the peak of the pyramid and most

3549
02:43:53,570 --> 02:43:48,060
of them knew nothing

3550
02:43:55,910 --> 02:43:53,580
many wanted to know but they did they

3551
02:43:57,830 --> 02:43:55,920
did not have access and so I asked them

3552
02:43:59,150 --> 02:43:57,840
I said well what what do you

3553
02:44:00,830 --> 02:43:59,160
I think I know what you're trying to

3554
02:44:02,450 --> 02:44:00,840
tell me but you want to like spell this

3555
02:44:04,250 --> 02:44:02,460
out a little bit more I said yeah

3556
02:44:05,870 --> 02:44:04,260
I I well I asked them do you think

3557
02:44:08,150 --> 02:44:05,880
there's a group Behind these people

3558
02:44:09,770 --> 02:44:08,160
that's more powerful that's actually

3559
02:44:11,650 --> 02:44:09,780
running and he said yes exactly that's

3560
02:44:14,330 --> 02:44:11,660
exactly what I think

3561
02:44:16,250 --> 02:44:14,340
like like uh you know like an mj-12 or

3562
02:44:19,070 --> 02:44:16,260
like the bilderbergers or whoever that

3563
02:44:21,469 --> 02:44:19,080
are behind the power that they're

3564
02:44:26,510 --> 02:44:21,479
running it not not these people

3565
02:44:28,849 --> 02:44:26,520
and uh on the on this list right right

3566
02:44:33,170 --> 02:44:28,859
here where it says get Authority it says

3567
02:44:37,309 --> 02:44:33,180
right here Poindexter right nope

3568
02:44:38,929 --> 02:44:37,319
no and not Poindexter and it is very

3569
02:44:42,110 --> 02:44:38,939
high up at that time back in the 19th

3570
02:44:45,770 --> 02:44:42,120
she was he was and and and like I said

3571
02:44:48,830 --> 02:44:45,780
it's uh I don't know who Dr Cooper is

3572
02:44:51,230 --> 02:44:48,840
but it says no to Dr Cooper and then

3573
02:44:53,830 --> 02:44:51,240
over here Poindexter no and then over

3574
02:44:58,210 --> 02:44:53,840
here then it says maybe

3575
02:45:01,130 --> 02:44:58,220
Poindexter right like maybe maybe maybe

3576
02:45:03,250 --> 02:45:01,140
Poindexter might know uh but that goes

3577
02:45:07,630 --> 02:45:03,260
back exactly to your point

3578
02:45:10,790 --> 02:45:07,640
uh that uh for for

3579
02:45:13,550 --> 02:45:10,800
uh this is why I think it's so

3580
02:45:15,170 --> 02:45:13,560
significant if the president doesn't

3581
02:45:16,670 --> 02:45:15,180
know the vice president doesn't know

3582
02:45:19,190 --> 02:45:16,680
they don't have any Authority this

3583
02:45:21,710 --> 02:45:19,200
program Admiral Poindexter doesn't have

3584
02:45:24,349 --> 02:45:21,720
any Authority here uh Admiral Wilson

3585
02:45:26,510 --> 02:45:24,359
doesn't have any Authority here and

3586
02:45:29,570 --> 02:45:26,520
there's a bigot list that doesn't have

3587
02:45:31,790 --> 02:45:29,580
any politicians on it when we're doing

3588
02:45:35,990 --> 02:45:31,800
these hearings with these elected

3589
02:45:38,090 --> 02:45:36,000
officials they are clearly way down no

3590
02:45:40,670 --> 02:45:38,100
matter what type of security

3591
02:45:43,070 --> 02:45:40,680
intelligence committee or subcommittee

3592
02:45:44,510 --> 02:45:43,080
you're on you're not read into this and

3593
02:45:47,210 --> 02:45:44,520
you're asking questions about something

3594
02:45:49,250 --> 02:45:47,220
that you don't know anything about you

3595
02:45:51,950 --> 02:45:49,260
have never been told anything about it

3596
02:45:54,050 --> 02:45:51,960
and you probably never will that is the

3597
02:45:56,570 --> 02:45:54,060
case right yeah

3598
02:45:58,969 --> 02:45:56,580
yeah I mean a lot of ways our problem uh

3599
02:46:01,550 --> 02:45:58,979
as Citizens if we're an American citizen

3600
02:46:03,710 --> 02:46:01,560
you know we're still wedded to this idea

3601
02:46:06,290 --> 02:46:03,720
that our government's supposed to be

3602
02:46:07,370 --> 02:46:06,300
responsive to us I'm certainly wedded to

3603
02:46:10,910 --> 02:46:07,380
that idea

3604
02:46:13,130 --> 02:46:10,920
but uh the way this our system actually

3605
02:46:14,210 --> 02:46:13,140
works is totally different it's totally

3606
02:46:16,610 --> 02:46:14,220
different

3607
02:46:18,650 --> 02:46:16,620
and you know we uh when you're in your

3608
02:46:19,670 --> 02:46:18,660
civics class in elementary school or

3609
02:46:21,889 --> 02:46:19,680
whatever if they have that anymore

3610
02:46:23,510 --> 02:46:21,899
probably not you're taught yes you know

3611
02:46:25,010 --> 02:46:23,520
here's we have elections you vote for

3612
02:46:26,270 --> 02:46:25,020
your member of Congress they go in there

3613
02:46:27,889 --> 02:46:26,280
and they work for you and if you don't

3614
02:46:29,809 --> 02:46:27,899
like them you vote them out and bring

3615
02:46:31,790 --> 02:46:29,819
someone else in that's not the system

3616
02:46:35,270 --> 02:46:31,800
doesn't work like that it's a it's a

3617
02:46:38,270 --> 02:46:35,280
completely that is all all veneer I

3618
02:46:41,330 --> 02:46:38,280
think we all realize this now it's not a

3619
02:46:43,730 --> 02:46:41,340
there's no acts any democracy or

3620
02:46:45,830 --> 02:46:43,740
Democratic anything that's all sham

3621
02:46:47,809 --> 02:46:45,840
that's all just doesn't exist

3622
02:46:50,090 --> 02:46:47,819
what we and and almost you could almost

3623
02:46:52,010 --> 02:46:50,100
say it it can't exist

3624
02:46:55,670 --> 02:46:52,020
that's really the problem the United

3625
02:46:56,870 --> 02:46:55,680
States is a global Empire it straddles

3626
02:46:59,990 --> 02:46:56,880
the globe

3627
02:47:02,210 --> 02:47:00,000
and it is um in the business of

3628
02:47:03,650 --> 02:47:02,220
maintaining that Empire and uh this is

3629
02:47:04,790 --> 02:47:03,660
what happened with Rome you know you

3630
02:47:07,610 --> 02:47:04,800
were talking about Roman history and

3631
02:47:08,809 --> 02:47:07,620
Caesar and Poppy well uh what happened

3632
02:47:11,510 --> 02:47:08,819
with Rome it's the same thing's

3633
02:47:14,929 --> 02:47:11,520
Happening Here Rome was created as a

3634
02:47:16,490 --> 02:47:14,939
republic by Romans who lived in Rome who

3635
02:47:17,929 --> 02:47:16,500
you know who lived under Roman laws they

3636
02:47:19,130 --> 02:47:17,939
and ended up spreading all over the

3637
02:47:21,170 --> 02:47:19,140
Mediterranean bringing in all these

3638
02:47:22,010 --> 02:47:21,180
cultures you can't run it like that

3639
02:47:23,750 --> 02:47:22,020
anymore

3640
02:47:25,309 --> 02:47:23,760
you have to have a different system and

3641
02:47:27,469 --> 02:47:25,319
that's what happened to America

3642
02:47:29,450 --> 02:47:27,479
but we've maintained the veneer of our

3643
02:47:30,410 --> 02:47:29,460
old system which we're still we believe

3644
02:47:33,110 --> 02:47:30,420
in

3645
02:47:34,790 --> 02:47:33,120
but it doesn't work like that so the

3646
02:47:38,030 --> 02:47:34,800
politicians I think are totally out of

3647
02:47:42,590 --> 02:47:38,040
the loop well okay so

3648
02:47:44,510 --> 02:47:42,600
So to that end if you have a way let's

3649
02:47:46,010 --> 02:47:44,520
go back to the UFO hearing right and

3650
02:47:49,250 --> 02:47:46,020
you're on the subcommittee and you're

3651
02:47:52,610 --> 02:47:49,260
asking questions to somebody that

3652
02:47:54,469 --> 02:47:52,620
um uh it seems evasive in their answers

3653
02:47:57,889 --> 02:47:54,479
but it's because that they don't know

3654
02:48:02,150 --> 02:47:57,899
right and it is so compartmentalized and

3655
02:48:04,190 --> 02:48:02,160
segmented out from there and they are

3656
02:48:07,910 --> 02:48:04,200
not in communication with any they have

3657
02:48:10,190 --> 02:48:07,920
no idea what program is being run out

3658
02:48:13,130 --> 02:48:10,200
there and if there is a vehicle that is

3659
02:48:15,650 --> 02:48:13,140
in possession of some Corporation

3660
02:48:17,870 --> 02:48:15,660
um somebody that is running the UAP task

3661
02:48:20,150 --> 02:48:17,880
force isn't going to have that that

3662
02:48:22,849 --> 02:48:20,160
information and yeah keep in mind you

3663
02:48:24,889 --> 02:48:22,859
know the two guys uh Scott Bray and

3664
02:48:26,690 --> 02:48:24,899
Ronald Moultrie were the two uh Pentagon

3665
02:48:28,070 --> 02:48:26,700
spokesperson so let's just think about

3666
02:48:29,929 --> 02:48:28,080
these guys for a minute I have no I have

3667
02:48:31,309 --> 02:48:29,939
no beef against either they're you know

3668
02:48:32,510 --> 02:48:31,319
I assume they're political appointees

3669
02:48:35,809 --> 02:48:32,520
and

3670
02:48:37,490 --> 02:48:35,819
made the right back room deals whatever

3671
02:48:39,469 --> 02:48:37,500
so they get this position and now they

3672
02:48:40,610 --> 02:48:39,479
have they have to speak to Congress how

3673
02:48:42,590 --> 02:48:40,620
much do we really think they actually

3674
02:48:44,690 --> 02:48:42,600
they know about this first of all the

3675
02:48:48,710 --> 02:48:44,700
UFO subject is it's actually a hard

3676
02:48:50,450 --> 02:48:48,720
subject it takes time I don't care how

3677
02:48:52,610 --> 02:48:50,460
well plugged in you are I don't care

3678
02:48:55,250 --> 02:48:52,620
what you're who's briefing you this is

3679
02:48:59,450 --> 02:48:55,260
complex and it takes a long amount of

3680
02:49:01,429 --> 02:48:59,460
time to become truly familiar with this

3681
02:49:04,610 --> 02:49:01,439
phenomenon and I mean the history I mean

3682
02:49:06,530 --> 02:49:04,620
to understand it I'm speaking here from

3683
02:49:09,110 --> 02:49:06,540
experience because I have dedicated

3684
02:49:11,389 --> 02:49:09,120
myself to it it's taken me time and it's

3685
02:49:13,610 --> 02:49:11,399
hard work so I can say right now there's

3686
02:49:17,450 --> 02:49:13,620
no way those two really know much about

3687
02:49:17,990 --> 02:49:17,460
this I I would say that very confidently

3688
02:49:20,090 --> 02:49:18,000
um

3689
02:49:21,650 --> 02:49:20,100
but it's their job they got they got a

3690
02:49:23,630 --> 02:49:21,660
you know blah blah to Congress they got

3691
02:49:25,910 --> 02:49:23,640
to do the whole thing bring out the dog

3692
02:49:27,050 --> 02:49:25,920
and pony show and

3693
02:49:29,030 --> 02:49:27,060
um

3694
02:49:31,370 --> 02:49:29,040
I I would guarantee they don't really

3695
02:49:33,889 --> 02:49:31,380
know very much and and if you're

3696
02:49:36,230 --> 02:49:33,899
as I I remember a year ago talking with

3697
02:49:38,510 --> 02:49:36,240
uh Lou Elizondo about

3698
02:49:39,770 --> 02:49:38,520
uh what was in the UAP task force that

3699
02:49:42,230 --> 02:49:39,780
was coming up

3700
02:49:45,469 --> 02:49:42,240
and in advance of that he made it

3701
02:49:48,110 --> 02:49:45,479
privately to me in a very excellent

3702
02:49:50,090 --> 02:49:48,120
point which I think he said later

3703
02:49:52,250 --> 02:49:50,100
which is that like there's no way that

3704
02:49:55,670 --> 02:49:52,260
any task force would have the ability to

3705
02:49:57,349 --> 02:49:55,680
do the research to find the programs to

3706
02:49:58,849 --> 02:49:57,359
get the data actually to do anything

3707
02:50:01,849 --> 02:49:58,859
that would be remotely a proper

3708
02:50:04,309 --> 02:50:01,859
investigation of the UAP UFO phenomenon

3709
02:50:05,690 --> 02:50:04,319
that's right you'd have the Manpower

3710
02:50:07,550 --> 02:50:05,700
they have the skills they have the

3711
02:50:08,870 --> 02:50:07,560
ability to knock on enough doors to get

3712
02:50:10,790 --> 02:50:08,880
the answers

3713
02:50:12,889 --> 02:50:10,800
you're talking about the U.S government

3714
02:50:14,389 --> 02:50:12,899
for God's sake the US military the

3715
02:50:16,429 --> 02:50:14,399
intelligence community

3716
02:50:18,170 --> 02:50:16,439
they're going to get just walk in and

3717
02:50:20,330 --> 02:50:18,180
get access to this stuff well it's the

3718
02:50:22,610 --> 02:50:20,340
same with these two guys they're not

3719
02:50:24,590 --> 02:50:22,620
going to have the access

3720
02:50:27,650 --> 02:50:24,600
guaranteed they they don't have full

3721
02:50:30,050 --> 02:50:27,660
access to almost anything

3722
02:50:32,389 --> 02:50:30,060
um and so you know what's their job they

3723
02:50:36,530 --> 02:50:32,399
they uh they put out these banal

3724
02:50:38,030 --> 02:50:36,540
ridiculous statements to Congress like

3725
02:50:40,849 --> 02:50:38,040
the one that made me laugh the most was

3726
02:50:43,250 --> 02:50:40,859
when Moultrie says well we believe if we

3727
02:50:46,130 --> 02:50:43,260
just had enough information on these we

3728
02:50:49,370 --> 02:50:46,140
would be able to identify and if

3729
02:50:51,050 --> 02:50:49,380
necessary mitigate these objects I'm

3730
02:50:53,410 --> 02:50:51,060
like dude you're not mitigating anything

3731
02:50:57,830 --> 02:50:53,420
you've the US military has never

3732
02:51:00,110 --> 02:50:57,840
mitigated UFOs ever they can't do it

3733
02:51:02,690 --> 02:51:00,120
they've tried they can't

3734
02:51:05,510 --> 02:51:02,700
But but so what really happened with

3735
02:51:08,270 --> 02:51:05,520
those hearings back in May is that we

3736
02:51:10,670 --> 02:51:08,280
graduated as a nation to where we were

3737
02:51:14,330 --> 02:51:10,680
back in the 1950s on this whole thing

3738
02:51:16,309 --> 02:51:14,340
because in the 1950s 1952 you had John

3739
02:51:18,469 --> 02:51:16,319
Samford giving his press conference

3740
02:51:20,570 --> 02:51:18,479
after the Washington sightings over D.C

3741
02:51:22,490 --> 02:51:20,580
and he's basically saying the same thing

3742
02:51:26,150 --> 02:51:22,500
that that Moultrie and Bray were saying

3743
02:51:28,130 --> 02:51:26,160
last you know spring yes we believe that

3744
02:51:29,690 --> 02:51:28,140
with uh we could identify these and

3745
02:51:31,790 --> 02:51:29,700
there's no national security threat

3746
02:51:34,250 --> 02:51:31,800
don't get too worked up about this

3747
02:51:37,429 --> 02:51:34,260
people you know Samford said it in 52

3748
02:51:40,670 --> 02:51:37,439
these guys are saying it in 2020 too 70

3749
02:51:42,770 --> 02:51:40,680
years later we we've gotten back to that

3750
02:51:45,290 --> 02:51:42,780
level because for many years we were not

3751
02:51:48,770 --> 02:51:45,300
even at that level we were at total

3752
02:51:49,969 --> 02:51:48,780
denial after Blue Book closed in 69 what

3753
02:51:51,410 --> 02:51:49,979
was the government then the government's

3754
02:51:53,570 --> 02:51:51,420
like oh there's no UFOs we don't even

3755
02:51:55,730 --> 02:51:53,580
investigate it well that was a lie of

3756
02:51:58,130 --> 02:51:55,740
course that went all the way through the

3757
02:52:00,530 --> 02:51:58,140
years so now we're we're like oh wow we

3758
02:52:03,110 --> 02:52:00,540
have all this openness no we don't out

3759
02:52:05,750 --> 02:52:03,120
we've just gone back to the 1950s we we

3760
02:52:07,429 --> 02:52:05,760
haven't we haven't moved an inch from

3761
02:52:09,889 --> 02:52:07,439
that period in fact in a lot of ways

3762
02:52:12,230 --> 02:52:09,899
we're we're less we're at a more

3763
02:52:14,690 --> 02:52:12,240
dishonest phase even now

3764
02:52:16,849 --> 02:52:14,700
back in the 50s there was independent

3765
02:52:18,950 --> 02:52:16,859
journalism that was at least trying to

3766
02:52:21,710 --> 02:52:18,960
work on this now what we have is a such

3767
02:52:23,030 --> 02:52:21,720
an utterly controlled media uh there's

3768
02:52:24,769 --> 02:52:23,040
there's people like you and there's

3769
02:52:26,750 --> 02:52:24,779
independent people but in terms of the

3770
02:52:30,170 --> 02:52:26,760
media system it's it's worse than it's

3771
02:52:32,750 --> 02:52:30,180
ever been do you remember when

3772
02:52:36,230 --> 02:52:32,760
um Bray I think it was Gallagher that

3773
02:52:38,510 --> 02:52:36,240
brought up Malmstrom right and probably

3774
02:52:40,370 --> 02:52:38,520
because he brought up Wilson Davis as

3775
02:52:42,950 --> 02:52:40,380
well right he had some very comfortable

3776
02:52:44,990 --> 02:52:42,960
questions yeah and he goes uh you know

3777
02:52:47,450 --> 02:52:45,000
uh you know over our nuclear missile

3778
02:52:50,090 --> 02:52:47,460
silos Mountain Air Force Base and Bray

3779
02:52:53,150 --> 02:52:50,100
turns to uh moulter he goes

3780
02:52:57,070 --> 02:52:53,160
I've never heard of it have you oh I I

3781
02:52:59,090 --> 02:52:57,080
tried I was a total lie

3782
02:53:01,670 --> 02:52:59,100
and just like they never heard of the

3783
02:53:04,250 --> 02:53:01,680
Wilson Davis notes like no we never

3784
02:53:05,210 --> 02:53:04,260
heard of that sure either one sure you

3785
02:53:07,730 --> 02:53:05,220
didn't

3786
02:53:08,990 --> 02:53:07,740
are you kidding me they all I don't know

3787
02:53:10,670 --> 02:53:09,000
what kind of language I need to avoid

3788
02:53:12,530 --> 02:53:10,680
here but they all probably had a little

3789
02:53:14,330 --> 02:53:12,540
accident inside themselves there at that

3790
02:53:16,790 --> 02:53:14,340
moment when this gets raised because

3791
02:53:18,830 --> 02:53:16,800
well you know or essentially

3792
02:53:21,469 --> 02:53:18,840
they just you know it was all worked out

3793
02:53:22,910 --> 02:53:21,479
we got to deny deny deny deny certain

3794
02:53:25,370 --> 02:53:22,920
these things like I'd never heard of

3795
02:53:28,429 --> 02:53:25,380
that never heard Malmstrom nuclear

3796
02:53:33,650 --> 02:53:28,439
connection what you know they have to

3797
02:53:36,530 --> 02:53:33,660
sustain this ignorance so uh back to uh

3798
02:53:38,630 --> 02:53:36,540
the Wilson Davis notes uh when they were

3799
02:53:42,469 --> 02:53:38,640
I'm just going to say Lockheed with the

3800
02:53:43,849 --> 02:53:42,479
three right when they said you can do

3801
02:53:46,250 --> 02:53:43,859
whatever you want

3802
02:53:48,290 --> 02:53:46,260
it it doesn't matter just just go go

3803
02:53:50,030 --> 02:53:48,300
back to Washington and and tell the

3804
02:53:51,830 --> 02:53:50,040
president we don't give a [\h__\h] right

3805
02:53:55,550 --> 02:53:51,840
okay

3806
02:53:56,750 --> 02:53:55,560
um that's exactly the situation that

3807
02:53:58,910 --> 02:53:56,760
we're in today

3808
02:54:01,010 --> 02:53:58,920
that whoever is in charge of these

3809
02:54:03,889 --> 02:54:01,020
programs they don't care about a UFO

3810
02:54:08,030 --> 02:54:03,899
hearing they don't care about any

3811
02:54:11,349 --> 02:54:08,040
discount they they are above all of that

3812
02:54:14,809 --> 02:54:11,359
and they really don't give a crap and

3813
02:54:16,309 --> 02:54:14,819
deeply protected yes

3814
02:54:18,950 --> 02:54:16,319
um and and you know again I'll just

3815
02:54:20,870 --> 02:54:18,960
mention when the New Yorker

3816
02:54:22,969 --> 02:54:20,880
uh was this two years ago they did their

3817
02:54:25,429 --> 02:54:22,979
piece and they had Harry Reid quoted in

3818
02:54:27,710 --> 02:54:25,439
there and I mean for the New Yorker this

3819
02:54:29,090 --> 02:54:27,720
is a pretty good piece of UFO journalism

3820
02:54:31,969 --> 02:54:29,100
frankly

3821
02:54:35,389 --> 02:54:31,979
uh and read in that article talked about

3822
02:54:36,950 --> 02:54:35,399
a connection with this two Lockheed

3823
02:54:38,990 --> 02:54:36,960
uh

3824
02:54:42,410 --> 02:54:39,000
I mean that was a very significant thing

3825
02:54:46,370 --> 02:54:42,420
and he immediately had to walk that back

3826
02:54:48,410 --> 02:54:46,380
in a tweet the next day yeah it was the

3827
02:54:51,230 --> 02:54:48,420
next day after the publication smacked

3828
02:54:53,090 --> 02:54:51,240
his knuckles and said uh come on now

3829
02:54:54,530 --> 02:54:53,100
you can't say this

3830
02:54:56,990 --> 02:54:54,540
that's why I said he pulled a Buzz

3831
02:54:59,090 --> 02:54:57,000
Aldrin you know Aldrin every now and

3832
02:55:00,710 --> 02:54:59,100
then comes up with these statements and

3833
02:55:03,710 --> 02:55:00,720
he has to retract them that's what Harry

3834
02:55:05,809 --> 02:55:03,720
Reid did he had to do the same thing is

3835
02:55:08,330 --> 02:55:05,819
that is that why

3836
02:55:09,889 --> 02:55:08,340
um you know your efforts and other great

3837
02:55:11,870 --> 02:55:09,899
researchers

3838
02:55:13,490 --> 02:55:11,880
um and investigators inside of the UFO

3839
02:55:16,730 --> 02:55:13,500
Community

3840
02:55:18,830 --> 02:55:16,740
um uh that the work that is done here is

3841
02:55:22,309 --> 02:55:18,840
is very important and we can't lose

3842
02:55:24,650 --> 02:55:22,319
sight of uh what we have been doing for

3843
02:55:27,050 --> 02:55:24,660
decades and we can't depend on

3844
02:55:30,410 --> 02:55:27,060
Washington D.C really to do anything

3845
02:55:31,969 --> 02:55:30,420
right we we have to uh you know we can't

3846
02:55:35,210 --> 02:55:31,979
relax

3847
02:55:38,950 --> 02:55:35,220
right that's that's right now what I

3848
02:55:43,370 --> 02:55:41,690
we need Washington DC to do what we tell

3849
02:55:44,750 --> 02:55:43,380
them to do and they're not they don't do

3850
02:55:46,429 --> 02:55:44,760
that

3851
02:55:48,349 --> 02:55:46,439
I mean the wheels have fallen off the

3852
02:55:49,550 --> 02:55:48,359
vehicle here I mean I don't know who's

3853
02:55:50,929 --> 02:55:49,560
steering this thing I don't know if

3854
02:55:53,090 --> 02:55:50,939
those there's no breaks there's no

3855
02:55:54,889 --> 02:55:53,100
control that the people exercise over

3856
02:55:57,950 --> 02:55:54,899
this government of ours we all know that

3857
02:56:00,170 --> 02:55:57,960
but we

3858
02:56:02,690 --> 02:56:00,180
we cannot give up

3859
02:56:04,010 --> 02:56:02,700
on trying to make that government do our

3860
02:56:05,690 --> 02:56:04,020
bidding that's what it's supposed to do

3861
02:56:10,790 --> 02:56:05,700
it doesn't

3862
02:56:12,710 --> 02:56:10,800
I mean you just throw in the white the

3863
02:56:14,570 --> 02:56:12,720
white flag the throw in the towel and

3864
02:56:16,790 --> 02:56:14,580
just give up I I don't want to do that I

3865
02:56:18,710 --> 02:56:16,800
don't think most people do so it's a

3866
02:56:20,929 --> 02:56:18,720
really difficult problem because

3867
02:56:23,690 --> 02:56:20,939
um the government is is utterly out of

3868
02:56:25,910 --> 02:56:23,700
control and is in my opinion is just is

3869
02:56:27,290 --> 02:56:25,920
that it's most unresponsive to the

3870
02:56:29,269 --> 02:56:27,300
people that have ever been in history

3871
02:56:31,130 --> 02:56:29,279
it's like right now

3872
02:56:32,690 --> 02:56:31,140
it's my that's my take on it it's it's

3873
02:56:35,809 --> 02:56:32,700
never been worse

3874
02:56:37,849 --> 02:56:35,819
so um and it can get worse still it

3875
02:56:40,790 --> 02:56:37,859
probably will get worse

3876
02:56:42,230 --> 02:56:40,800
so getting uh answers on this phenomenon

3877
02:56:44,330 --> 02:56:42,240
this is really important to do because

3878
02:56:45,950 --> 02:56:44,340
you know the world is uh spinning out of

3879
02:56:47,750 --> 02:56:45,960
control right now

3880
02:56:50,870 --> 02:56:47,760
100 years ago my favorite poet William

3881
02:56:52,790 --> 02:56:50,880
Butler Yates said the center cannot hold

3882
02:56:55,429 --> 02:56:52,800
Things Fall Apart the center cannot hold

3883
02:56:57,530 --> 02:56:55,439
me or Anarchy is loose upon the world

3884
02:56:59,990 --> 02:56:57,540
and we're seeing it like we are seeing

3885
02:57:01,910 --> 02:57:00,000
it and and fact is there's many many

3886
02:57:03,950 --> 02:57:01,920
things that are happening that are

3887
02:57:06,710 --> 02:57:03,960
serious problem

3888
02:57:08,929 --> 02:57:06,720
uh and will economically politically

3889
02:57:12,469 --> 02:57:08,939
militarily and all of that but the thing

3890
02:57:14,450 --> 02:57:12,479
is the the UFO phenomenon is so

3891
02:57:17,389 --> 02:57:14,460
important and it's easy for people to

3892
02:57:20,809 --> 02:57:17,399
forget this because a it it represents

3893
02:57:23,690 --> 02:57:20,819
let's just not forget what do these

3894
02:57:26,269 --> 02:57:23,700
Davis Wilson notes that's the most

3895
02:57:28,429 --> 02:57:26,279
important takeaway is that aliens are

3896
02:57:30,769 --> 02:57:28,439
real and they are here

3897
02:57:32,210 --> 02:57:30,779
that's actually the first takeaway

3898
02:57:35,750 --> 02:57:32,220
because we got their stuff and we're

3899
02:57:37,070 --> 02:57:35,760
studying it aliens are here on this

3900
02:57:38,929 --> 02:57:37,080
planet

3901
02:57:41,330 --> 02:57:38,939
and this is

3902
02:57:44,030 --> 02:57:41,340
and and they are here in a clandestine

3903
02:57:46,190 --> 02:57:44,040
Manner and this isn't trying to like

3904
02:57:48,290 --> 02:57:46,200
scare people but the fact is they are

3905
02:57:50,150 --> 02:57:48,300
here in what seemed to me to be large

3906
02:57:52,610 --> 02:57:50,160
numbers in a completely secretive

3907
02:57:54,830 --> 02:57:52,620
clandestine way and they are engaged and

3908
02:57:57,349 --> 02:57:54,840
they're not doing hands-off stuff here

3909
02:57:59,630 --> 02:57:57,359
they do abduct people

3910
02:58:01,370 --> 02:57:59,640
Tracy and I talked to abductees almost

3911
02:58:04,010 --> 02:58:01,380
all the time these days this is like a

3912
02:58:06,590 --> 02:58:04,020
big thing that we're both engaged in and

3913
02:58:07,790 --> 02:58:06,600
and most of these abductees can't they

3914
02:58:09,110 --> 02:58:07,800
don't want to go public they don't want

3915
02:58:10,010 --> 02:58:09,120
to talk to the world but they'll talk to

3916
02:58:12,410 --> 02:58:10,020
us

3917
02:58:14,870 --> 02:58:12,420
and I can tell you this like Abduction

3918
02:58:17,570 --> 02:58:14,880
still happen so these the aliens are not

3919
02:58:20,269 --> 02:58:17,580
just disinterested scientists just

3920
02:58:23,090 --> 02:58:20,279
watching the [\h__\h] show sorry that is

3921
02:58:27,290 --> 02:58:23,100
planet Earth they are here

3922
02:58:28,610 --> 02:58:27,300
doing things and and let's this must be

3923
02:58:31,969 --> 02:58:28,620
said it and I know I'm running out of

3924
02:58:33,349 --> 02:58:31,979
time they are engaged in large-scale

3925
02:58:37,190 --> 02:58:33,359
activity

3926
02:58:39,650 --> 02:58:37,200
at a moment in our history as a species

3927
02:58:42,110 --> 02:58:39,660
when we are going through the most

3928
02:58:44,210 --> 02:58:42,120
fundamental transformation that human

3929
02:58:46,670 --> 02:58:44,220
beings have ever gone through we are

3930
02:58:48,410 --> 02:58:46,680
transforming our society into what I

3931
02:58:52,429 --> 02:58:48,420
keep calling the fourth stage of

3932
02:58:54,530 --> 02:58:52,439
humanity and it is it's digital control

3933
02:58:56,570 --> 02:58:54,540
you know stage one is where hunters and

3934
02:58:58,730 --> 02:58:56,580
gatherers with Spears taking down big

3935
02:59:01,490 --> 02:58:58,740
animals stage two is we farm and we

3936
02:59:03,469 --> 02:59:01,500
create cities and birth of writing and

3937
02:59:04,429 --> 02:59:03,479
the wheel and all of that stage three is

3938
02:59:06,530 --> 02:59:04,439
science

3939
02:59:07,910 --> 02:59:06,540
an industry and we transform the world

3940
02:59:10,010 --> 02:59:07,920
and that's what we were all born into

3941
02:59:13,309 --> 02:59:10,020
but we're going into stage four

3942
02:59:14,870 --> 02:59:13,319
and stage four I can't even imagine all

3943
02:59:16,910 --> 02:59:14,880
the implications but let's just put it

3944
02:59:19,610 --> 02:59:16,920
together strong artificial intelligence

3945
02:59:23,090 --> 02:59:19,620
genetic complete genetic control and

3946
02:59:25,070 --> 02:59:23,100
transhumanism uh nanotech Quantum

3947
02:59:27,650 --> 02:59:25,080
computing

3948
02:59:30,530 --> 02:59:27,660
I mean holy crap and then complete

3949
02:59:32,410 --> 02:59:30,540
digital surveillance 24 7 over every

3950
02:59:35,269 --> 02:59:32,420
single person for the rest of all time

3951
02:59:37,190 --> 02:59:35,279
and total micromanagement of the economy

3952
02:59:40,190 --> 02:59:37,200
so that forget economic freedom that's

3953
02:59:43,550 --> 02:59:40,200
that's fewer and fewer people so it's a

3954
02:59:46,190 --> 02:59:43,560
it's a massive giant ant hill of

3955
02:59:47,990 --> 02:59:46,200
humanity we're creating it right now

3956
02:59:49,969 --> 02:59:48,000
we're going through a global Revolution

3957
02:59:51,830 --> 02:59:49,979
at the moment

3958
02:59:55,070 --> 02:59:51,840
in our

3959
02:59:59,510 --> 02:59:55,080
history as a species when this presence

3960
03:00:01,849 --> 02:59:59,520
of these beings is clearly at its most

3961
03:00:03,950 --> 03:00:01,859
intense ever yeah they've probably been

3962
03:00:05,330 --> 03:00:03,960
here a long time I do believe that but

3963
03:00:07,670 --> 03:00:05,340
not in these numbers I don't believe

3964
03:00:11,150 --> 03:00:07,680
that they are everywhere and they are

3965
03:00:13,670 --> 03:00:11,160
engaged and they are deeply embedded and

3966
03:00:17,090 --> 03:00:13,680
committed to whatever is happening

3967
03:00:18,830 --> 03:00:17,100
to us and and I keep asking myself do

3968
03:00:21,230 --> 03:00:18,840
they support this are they opposed to

3969
03:00:22,550 --> 03:00:21,240
what's going on or do they not care and

3970
03:00:25,250 --> 03:00:22,560
you know to be honest I think they

3971
03:00:26,630 --> 03:00:25,260
support it I think we're we're becoming

3972
03:00:28,309 --> 03:00:26,640
like them

3973
03:00:30,469 --> 03:00:28,319
something I don't like

3974
03:00:32,269 --> 03:00:30,479
I I'll I'll just pass thank you very

3975
03:00:34,429 --> 03:00:32,279
much I don't want to be like them I

3976
03:00:37,010 --> 03:00:34,439
don't want to be part of a hive mind

3977
03:00:40,190 --> 03:00:37,020
I don't want that but

3978
03:00:43,370 --> 03:00:40,200
that to me seems to be what is happening

3979
03:00:46,130 --> 03:00:43,380
and so I could I cannot help but ask

3980
03:00:48,710 --> 03:00:46,140
do they have anything to do with us

3981
03:00:51,769 --> 03:00:48,720
I may never get an answer to that

3982
03:00:53,690 --> 03:00:51,779
but God you know we gotta ask these

3983
03:00:56,030 --> 03:00:53,700
questions and me maybe try to

3984
03:00:57,530 --> 03:00:56,040
investigate to the whatever limited

3985
03:00:59,809 --> 03:00:57,540
extent that we can

3986
03:01:01,309 --> 03:00:59,819
because this is serious stuff it you

3987
03:01:02,990 --> 03:01:01,319
know I'm glad it's important that we

3988
03:01:05,929 --> 03:01:03,000
talk about these Davis Wilson notes

3989
03:01:07,849 --> 03:01:05,939
absolutely but to me what is the most

3990
03:01:10,670 --> 03:01:07,859
significant thing is the big picture

3991
03:01:12,530 --> 03:01:10,680
let's look go up like 30 40 000 feet and

3992
03:01:15,710 --> 03:01:12,540
look down and see these patterns that's

3993
03:01:18,469 --> 03:01:15,720
what they have to do and those notes are

3994
03:01:20,750 --> 03:01:18,479
a very key part and I'll just I know I'm

3995
03:01:22,429 --> 03:01:20,760
almost out of time what burns me more

3996
03:01:24,170 --> 03:01:22,439
than anything else about all of these

3997
03:01:26,269 --> 03:01:24,180
skeptical intransigence about these

3998
03:01:28,130 --> 03:01:26,279
notes over these last few years is that

3999
03:01:29,150 --> 03:01:28,140
they have stopped us in our tracks when

4000
03:01:31,010 --> 03:01:29,160
we should have been moving forward

4001
03:01:35,630 --> 03:01:31,020
that's right when I was talking with

4002
03:01:37,429 --> 03:01:35,640
Grant back in uh April of 90 of uh 2019.

4003
03:01:39,050 --> 03:01:37,439
and like Grant said to me well now

4004
03:01:42,050 --> 03:01:39,060
you're in the Box I'm in and I was like

4005
03:01:44,750 --> 03:01:42,060
yeah I feel like it but we both assumed

4006
03:01:47,870 --> 03:01:44,760
we both assumed that when these notes

4007
03:01:48,950 --> 03:01:47,880
came out it would be a firestorm and

4008
03:01:52,190 --> 03:01:48,960
what happened

4009
03:01:54,469 --> 03:01:52,200
try to dump a lot of cold water all over

4010
03:01:57,170 --> 03:01:54,479
them and they succeeded to a large

4011
03:01:58,309 --> 03:01:57,180
extent and that was a travesty and I

4012
03:02:01,070 --> 03:01:58,319
would say that is a crime against

4013
03:02:03,530 --> 03:02:01,080
ufology and not just ufology because we

4014
03:02:06,469 --> 03:02:03,540
need those notes need to be understood

4015
03:02:08,450 --> 03:02:06,479
they need to be discussed and picked

4016
03:02:10,730 --> 03:02:08,460
apart and the implications need to be

4017
03:02:13,670 --> 03:02:10,740
made very clear

4018
03:02:17,030 --> 03:02:13,680
and we we really shot ourselves in both

4019
03:02:19,610 --> 03:02:17,040
feet by arguing these stupid arguments

4020
03:02:21,170 --> 03:02:19,620
over their authenticity which was just

4021
03:02:22,490 --> 03:02:21,180
beneath us all

4022
03:02:25,670 --> 03:02:22,500
right and and thank you for everything

4023
03:02:28,429 --> 03:02:25,680
Richard and I'll I'll end on this note

4024
03:02:31,070 --> 03:02:28,439
um I remember uh since probably uh four

4025
03:02:33,050 --> 03:02:31,080
years ago uh Richard and I were on a

4026
03:02:34,670 --> 03:02:33,060
phone call and Richard said church I'm

4027
03:02:37,730 --> 03:02:34,680
telling you right now

4028
03:02:40,010 --> 03:02:37,740
you and I are gonna ride this until the

4029
03:02:42,110 --> 03:02:40,020
end I don't know if we're gonna figure

4030
03:02:45,230 --> 03:02:42,120
it out but this is what we're going to

4031
03:02:47,030 --> 03:02:45,240
try to do to the end you remember that

4032
03:02:50,030 --> 03:02:47,040
don't you I do

4033
03:02:52,969 --> 03:02:50,040
thank you so much Richard uh behave be

4034
03:02:55,550 --> 03:02:52,979
well and I think this has just started

4035
03:02:57,170 --> 03:02:55,560
it's been an amazing week and and just

4036
03:02:59,150 --> 03:02:57,180
thank you for all of your efforts my

4037
03:03:02,510 --> 03:02:59,160
friend it was my pleasure to be on thank

4038
03:03:04,370 --> 03:03:02,520
you Jimmy Richard bleep and Dolan and

4039
03:03:07,190 --> 03:03:04,380
with that Richard have a good night give

4040
03:03:10,790 --> 03:03:07,200
my best to Tracy and uh Christina Gomez

4041
03:03:12,769 --> 03:03:10,800
told me to tell you yo so I got that out

4042
03:03:16,070 --> 03:03:12,779
of the way I'll talk to you see you

4043
03:03:18,889 --> 03:03:16,080
Richard have a great night Richard Dolan

4044
03:03:21,050 --> 03:03:18,899
and I've got to get straight out of here

4045
03:03:23,750 --> 03:03:21,060
I gotta get out of here before the

4046
03:03:25,190 --> 03:03:23,760
network Cuts me off this is Fade to

4047
03:03:27,110 --> 03:03:25,200
Black I am your host Jimmy church

4048
03:03:29,450 --> 03:03:27,120
tomorrow night is fader night with open

4049
03:03:31,190 --> 03:03:29,460
lines all night long Fade to Black is

4050
03:03:33,469 --> 03:03:31,200
produced by Hilton J Palm Renee Dennis

4051
03:03:35,809 --> 03:03:33,479
and Kevin announces our Steve Harvey

4052
03:03:37,870 --> 03:03:35,819
kovar what Masters drew the geek music

4053
03:03:40,309 --> 03:03:37,880
Doug Aldridge intro space boys

4054
03:03:42,230 --> 03:03:40,319
spaceboymusic.com fade to black is

4055
03:03:44,090 --> 03:03:42,240
produced by kjcr for the game changer

4056
03:03:46,429 --> 03:03:44,100
Network this broadcast is own a

4057
03:03:48,410 --> 03:03:46,439
copyrighted 2022 by Fade to Black in the

4058
03:03:49,969 --> 03:03:48,420
game changer Network Inc it cannot be

4059
03:03:51,290 --> 03:03:49,979
downloaded copied or used anywhere in

4060
03:03:52,670 --> 03:03:51,300
the known universe without written

4061
03:03:54,170 --> 03:03:52,680
permission from Fade to Black for the

4062
03:03:56,030 --> 03:03:54,180
game changer Network I'm your old Chevy

4063
03:03:59,389 --> 03:03:56,040
church tomorrow night is fader night

4064
03:04:00,530 --> 03:03:59,399
until then everybody be safe go back Lee

4065
03:04:01,330 --> 03:04:00,540
tappy

4066
03:04:08,450 --> 03:04:01,340
thank you

4067
03:04:29,630 --> 03:04:14,480
[Music]

4068
03:04:29,640 --> 03:04:36,640
thank you

4069
03:04:36,650 --> 03:04:40,269
[Music]